Has anyone achieved complete remission? (ie."NO" medication)

[RickK]

A simple question: Has anyone (on this discussion board or anyone you know) achieved compete remission of RA? …AND have been off “ALL” medications for over a year.
My thought is that antibiotic therapy only works if the patient stays on them (by suppressing the immune system), and once off of these antibiotics… symptoms return.

[Barb]

Hi RickK,

It’s funny you should ask – the reason I’m here tonight is MY answer to your question.

Roughly 10 yrs ago I was in horrible shape from RA w. pain 24/7.
This board and the many wonderful people here helped my survive emotionally and I learned what to do.
To make a long story short: I started Minocin, MoWeFr, and after 3yrs was convinced that it worked (had many doubts during the 3yrs). One thing, though, I had also totally cleaned up my diet.

Keeping the routine for the next 5yrs, I not only got better, I was normal again!! No more pain, Vertigo long gone!!!
I was so good, that I thought I was cured! So I stopped taking Minocin on 2/16/2011. Made a note in my calendar, so happy with myself.

Until about a month ago…. my right knee started hurting, and then my foot started swelling. When I ate a whole slice of ice cream cake at my grand daughter’s birthday, I knew it was the WRONG thing, and it was! This was a week ago and the knee-foot-ankle pain is right where it was 10yrs ago, very bad, disabling, relentless, costing me many hours of sleep.
So, I now know that “it’s back”.
I had always wondered about it, but hoped that I was needlessly wondering.

And by the way, the Minocin is NOT suppressing the immune system, that’s the job of Embrel, Remicade, I believe.
But what I now think is that some mycoplasma survive the “onslaught” of Minocin and when the Minocin stops, they multiply again.

Also, sugar feeds all the “bad guys” in our body bigtime! Including cancer.

So, I am here today to ask whether by now there are any doctors in NC, who know the protocol and prescribe Minocin.

BarbK

[Maz]

@barbknc wrote:

So, I am here today to ask whether by now there are any doctors in NC, who know the protocol and prescribe Minocin.

Barb, I’ll send you a PM (private message) with the list for NC. To retrieve your PM, just click up top beside your User Control Panel where it will say (1 new message).

[Barb]

Thanks so much, Maz!
Can’t wait.
Limped to a DO yesterday, driving was excruciatingly painful,
hoping he would be open minded after I explained my success
for the last, basically, 8 yrs.
But he was not. So, I am quite frustrated, because I have
become sooo slow (with my right side only painfully working)
and I get sooo little done.

I really love you all for what you are doing for everyone!!!
And for ALWAYS being there!!!

BarbK

[Maz]

Thanks, Barb! Just get well again, okay? We’re all here so come join us whenever you need support. 🙂 You had great success before, so there is every chance you will do well again.

[Maz]

Rick, I think the thing is that the folks who go into remission and later stop their AP, also go off to live their lives and have no need to come back to the discussion forum, so we don’t always hear from them unless they have come back with a testimonial or an update to their testimonial. I have spoken to a good number of folks, however, who have reached antibiotic-free/drug-free remission and have sustained it for years. The reason they come back is similar to Barb’s story…they have relapsed and want to go back to the treatment that helped them before.

When thinking about Brown’s “bacterial allergy” rationale, it would follow that when this bacterial hypersensitivity state is calmed, all is well and the rheumatic is fine, his immune-system re-trained not to over-react to bacterial antigenic substances. However, once that cellular memory is reactivated – perhaps by some acute infection, a stressor of some kind, like surgery, shock, accident, or just weakening of the immune system as one gets older, etc – it’s no wonder that a person begins to re-experience similar. Seems it’s not just rheumatics that relapse, but it’s well-known that chronic Lyme patients often relapse several times after reaching remission and abx have been stopped.

I guess the bottom line is that it’s just not possible to live in a bubble. Re-infection or re-activation of latent infections are always potential and if the bodily terrain has lost balance, then the old “ground-hog day” scenario is re-lived. If a person is responding to abx therapy, however, it’s probably the more benign method of treatment in the longer-term, provided that all precautions are taken to protect the gut and overall balance in the body.

[DragonSlayer]

Hello, RickK:

Antibiotics really can suppress a very minor and probably unrelated portion of the immune system.
And this type of drug really could have some limited anti-inflammatory properties.

But from the levels of healing I have personally achieved using my own protocol for a different inflammatory type disease (AS), I believe that there is absolutely no way to account for my total remission and eventual freedom from all drugs, except through recognition of the bacteria connection. I believe that I once had significant colonization and bactericidal agents should be credited with doing…what they are designed to do! Physicians and researchers who dismiss the germ-cause of RA and AS by such idle ruminations are just trying to dodge the real issue: We got results without them and without their poisons, and they cannot–with any credibility–insert themselves into the discussion no matter how hard they try! Less grant money is being chased by larger numbers of researchers.

HEALTH,
John

[RickK]

Thank you MAZ, DragonSlayer…
For me… I was treated for Lyme / RA with high dose antibiotics (among other medications) for over 2 years and had lots of side effects (or as I call them – “real” effects) such as double vision, complete bladder shutdown (hospitalized), and various gut issues. So I think abx are not for me (my body is just too sensitive). Matter of fact… I am shunning all medications at this time. I believe the 2 years of antibiotics really messed up my gut (leaky gut). If 80% of my immune system is in the gut and the abx therapy killed a large portion of bacteria… then I would say that abx suppresses the immune system.
At any rate… I have decided to try a more natural approach:
1. remove as many toxins as possible from entering the body
2. diet (only organic, juicing, no sugar or gmo’s, so on…) and fasting
3. vitamins / nutrients (seeing a naturopathic doctor)
4. proper exercise (easy yoga, light weights)
5. prayer / spiritual beliefs and positive thinking / imagination
So far…it’s been tough and I have gotten a little worse, but I believe, in time, the body knows how to heal itself if given the proper nutrients and care. We’ll see what happens in time. Take care to all.

[Maz]

Rick, I really am sorry to hear that you have had such a rough time. It is a very challenging journey for chronic Lymies with “autoimmune” manifestations, without doubt. My journey, too, has been very up and down and I give all credit to my ability to remain on long-term, high dose, combination abx therapy to the experienced LLMDs who have guided and closely monitored me.

Like you, some chronic Lyme patients have to stop their abx in order to re-balance things and re-gain gut health. In some instances, the mix of infections gets the upper hand and the abx just can’t break through the clever strategies these very pesky organisms have to evade both immune function and abx. Sometimes the picture gets so muddy, it’s hard to know if “system breakdown” is due to the abx or to under-treated or inappropriately-treated bugs or bugs in the mix that just haven’t been identified. It’s all such a fine balance and experience of the doctor can sometimes make all the difference.

Rick, if you are the same RickK, have we chatted on the phone a few times in the past? If so, did you manage to find an experienced LLMD in the end?

Wishing you every success as you move forward with your new regimen and, if you happen upon some aspect of your new path that you find has really helped you, please do come let us know.

All the very best to you, Rick! 🙂

[RickK]

Hi MAZ,
Yes… you and I have spoken in the past. I did find an experienced LLMD doctor, but it is difficult to know if the side effects that I incurred were due to his treatment or simply my body. At this point… I am going to try the “natural” approach. I think my body knows what to do. I am going to give it all it needs to repair itself. I will keep in touch occasionally to give an update. My thoughts to all who suffer…

[Maz]

@RickK wrote:

Hi MAZ,
I am going to give it all it needs to repair itself. I will keep in touch occasionally to give an update. My thoughts to all who suffer…

Thanks, Rick, for confirming it was you. And, thanks also for saying you’d stay in touch. Wishing you well and do hope you manage to get yourself back on track. 🙂

PS. You might be interested to look at the Dr. K. Protocols for Lyme, if you haven’t found them already.

http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/

[Trudi]

@RickK wrote:

I did find an experienced LLMD doctor, but it is difficult to know if the side effects that I incurred were due to his treatment or simply my body. At this point… I am going to try the “natural” approach. I think my body knows what to do. I am going to give it all it needs to repair itself.

Hi Rick–
I, too, had a lot of problems with the antibiotics. Just recently I found out that having the MTHFR 1298 mutation (homozygous) is probably one of the reasons.

In going with the “natural” approach, I would recommend the herbalist Stephen Buhner’s book Healing Lyme and his newest book, which I just finished and which has a ton of good information–Healing Lyme Disease Coinfections:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1620550083/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=1535523722&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0970869630&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1PWWN9WCWMSCQXR7JY55

I wish you the best in your journey back to good health–
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[richie]

Hi Rick –The meds didnt mess you up -your doctor did !!!! I am in full remission for scleroderma –remember remission doesnt mean cure –I still take 200 mg daily of minocin –have for 14 years –results –maybe two colds in that period of time –never pneumonia never anything else that can arise with a suppressed immune system –the reason for continuing the meds is the chance of relapse is fairly high so why risk it –I consider the minocin really benign with zero side effects-
richie

[laurawm]

Not everyone is the same, Richie. Antibiotic treatment can be very difficult for people who have pre-existing candida issues.

Laura

[richie]

Hi I do agree the candida must be addressed first -In order to use this approach
richie

[Author]

Posts