Depression, memory problems. What helps?

[Dee]

Everyone (including doctors) say my memory problems and tired feeling are a result of depression and I need to take an antidepressant.  I took lexapro for a while and it did not seem to work.  Even though I have high RF and Anti-CCP I have been told I have fibromyalgia and my pain is a result of the depression also.  I do have the AP now but I am wondering what do people do for the depression and memory problems?

[JBJBJB]

When I went to see my pulmonary doctor, he mentioned some weight loss and depression medicine could cause pulmonary fibrosis. I'd be very careful to research those medicine before taking them.

Diet and also herbal supplement can also help depression. A Friend may be able to give you some information since she has been really informative on RA diet.

JB 

[linda]

One of my biggest pet peeves is when people or doctors think that our depression causes the pain and fatigue. I do believe that there are those who suffer clinical depression because of chemical imbalances, and fatigue is one of the symptoms. But I also know that for myself, the depression followed the fatigue and pain, it did not precede it. This misconception that depression caused the other symptoms kept those with CFS and FMS from being taken seriously and delayed research into these diseases. When will we finally be able to convince doctors, our families and the public that depression is one of many symptoms of this group of diseases, not a cause?

That being said, it does need to be treated just as the pain and inflammation and fatigue are treated. From what I've read from other posts, many people find their depression worsens during a herx reaction; understanding why it's happening and that it is temporary can help us to deal with it. Exercise naturally increases serotonin levels, and there are some supplements that can be helpful. SAM-e and St. John's Wort are two that I've heard the most about. I've had some results with both of them, but exercise seems to work best if I can do it regularly.

There is no shame in treating depression with other meds, tho, if those things just are working well enough. One of the treatments for insomnia for those with FMS is antidepressants that are only taken before bedtime. Another option is to take antidepressants at a clinical dosage for depression for 3-4 months, until the worst of the herx is over or the disease is starting to go into remission. From what I've read on this board, the depression begins to go away as the abx start to work, just like the fatigue and memory fog, but it does take time.

linda

[DianeWI]

Hi Linda,

I have the same thing.  I got ill way before the depression clobbered me.  And I really don't feel super depressed most of the time.  I feel the fatigue from long-term illness and the memory loss.  I do believe that we need to take supplements for the memory issues which may also help depression.  I think this is one of my greatest pet-peeves with all this illness, when people accuse me of being depressed and all I have to do is think happy thoughts and I”ll be all better.  I have had to stay away from many of these types of people because I'm all done explaining when it does no good.  I have however, noticed that the medical profession is becoming more enlightened to long-term illness and what it can do to us.  It was way different 25 years ago.  So positive steps have been taken and more has been learned along the way.

Diane

[Maz]

Hi Dee,

You might find this article on the main website helpful regarding “Cognitive function in rheumatic disease and AP”:

https://www.roadback.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/education.display/display_id/189.html

Peace, Maz

[Texas T.]

Daine,

I absolutely agree with you – depression follows this disease – it is not necessarily a precursor.  The only bout of depression I've had was due to traditional Rheumy telling me I'd be on medication for the rest of my life and I may or may not get better with the drugs.  My depression was from thinking there was no HOPE – and that is the gives us – a true reason to HOPE for better health, better days, no pain…  And of course all the support from the fabulous folks who post here because they really know what we're going through as they too are in or were in the same dark place.[/color]

So please – dare to HOPE for better days – do not let this disease win.  We didn't invite it into our physical bodies – that was out of our control.  Dare to HOPE so we can keep it out of our emotional selves.

Teresa

[Joe M]

[user=11]linda[/user] wrote:

That being said, it does need to be treated just as the pain and inflammation and fatigue are treated. From what I've read from other posts, many people find their depression worsens during a herx reaction; understanding why it's happening and that it is temporary can help us to deal with it. Exercise naturally increases serotonin levels, and there are some supplements that can be helpful. SAM-e and St. John's Wort are two that I've heard the most about. I've had some results with both of them, but exercise seems to work best if I can do it regularly.

There is no shame in treating depression with other meds, tho, if those things just are working well enough. One of the treatments for insomnia for those with FMS is antidepressants that are only taken before bedtime. Another option is to take antidepressants at a clinical dosage for depression for 3-4 months, until the worst of the herx is over or the disease is starting to go into remission. From what I've read on this board, the depression begins to go away as the abx start to work, just like the fatigue and memory fog, but it does take time.

linda

Linda, thank you for saying that exercise is one of the best treatments for depression.  In fact, some studies show exercise is just as effective as anti-depressants.  I just responded to another post of yours where you mention all the toxic drugs handed out by physicians.  To me, there are no more toxic drugs than those that mess with brain chemicals – namely the anti-depressants.  People should definately try exercise first, although I know it is difficult to exercise if pain is a constant issue.

[Dee]

Thank all of you for your responses.  I often laugh at some of the things that I do or don't do because of my memory problems but it is also scary and embarassing.  (and please excuse the spelling if I have any thing spelled wrong here!) 

[Lynne G.SD]

Hi Dee;
     Joe is right on when he says exercise is one of the best ways to fight this problem.These diseases often affect our vascular systems  and the tiny blood vessels in the brain often have insufficient blood flow causing short and or long term memory loss and depression.Exercise brings up the heart rate and flow to all the body.If you have ever had Raynaud's and decided to get on the stationary bike or stepper you are warm as toast in just one minute.If you have Raynaud's it certainly affects the brain in the same way as your hands or feet.   Lynne

[linda]

Hi Joe,

Sorry to be contradicting myself; I do believe most people would rather take a pill than to try changing diet or exercise habits, and I believe we're better off if we can alleve symptoms without taking meds that can be harmful. But sometimes it's just not practical, especially if the more natural therapies aren't getting us well enough to work or function. I don't think all meds are bad, but we shouldn't rely solely on them for treating illnesses, and that's what I see happening in our society.

Exercise is absolutely good for depression, and also for arthritis. Where I feel that anti-depressants might be necessary is when somone is too ill from a herx or flare to do enough exercise to help. They're not my favorite category of meds, but I'd rather see someone take them for a few months to get thru the worst of a severe herx than have them give up because they feel the therapy is too difficult or not effective. Like some other meds, such as steroids, I would not recomment that anyone take them for a long period of time. I do have a neighbor who is bi-polar tho, who tried to wean off of her meds. For 6 months I felt like I was on suicide watch for her because she  just fell apart. She's been back on her meds for a few months now, and I'd like to say she's better but I can't. She's now swung too far in the other direction. I'm on the fence with anti-depressants; I guess I feel that for some people who are very ill the benefits outweigh the risks. But then some of them actually make the person worse, so I really don't know what to think about them.

Realistically, it takes more than one type of therapy to get these or any other chronic dx under control, and medications are a part of that therapy. In a perfect world, diet and exercise would cure everything!, at least they can reduce the number of pills we take and the amt of time we have to take them.

Glad to hear Michelle is doing so well.

linda

[klogan]

The depression is tough. It really was painful. For me, tt seemed to be part an adjustment reaction to the disease, and part the disease itself. Psychotherapy helped. Excercise helped. Kind friends helped. Crying helped.
But the bottom line, it was patience that helped, and adjusting to the disease. And random little things.
The two things I could always count on were green tea and mental arithmatic.  Go figure. I'm figuring I needed a shot of caffeine and meditation. But I was too crazed to try and sit and think of nothing, so i gave my brain a much needed break from worryworryworryfearfearfear with some mental arithmatic and always got a tiny sense of renewal, rest, and a little perspective.

I am sending my thoughts your way.

[richie]

Hi

I think your doctor got things backward –feeling fatigued and in pain is very much a product of the disease process not the depression –IMO depression occurs when one is in constant pain and is fatigued –I dont think one needs to be a doctor or rocket scientists to figure that out —I am also seeing a disturbing trend that some doctors who are unable to make a clear-cut diagnosis call it “fibromyalgia “in the rush to find a label –when I was younger -one would go to some doctors with unexplained pain and the phrase “neuralgia ” was used –Same BS in many instances —then what occurs —Symptoms worsen and and other symptoms occur –Some doctors then piously conclude the fibro evovled into lupus or MCTD or SD –when the fact is the disease was present in its very early stage  –that is why going to a doctor knowledgable about an antibiotic therapy just might get one started on AP at a very early juncture which is a huge advantage

Richie

[A Friend]

[user=241]Dee[/user] wrote:

Everyone (including doctors) say my memory problems and tired feeling are a result of depression and I need to take an antidepressant.  I took lexapro for a while and it did not seem to work.  Even though I have high RF and Anti-CCP I have been told I have fibromyalgia and my pain is a result of the depression also.  I do have the AP now but I am wondering what do people do for the depression and memory problems?

Dee,

Your doctor went to medical school, and I did not.  However, I've found the many things I've learned about the following things to be helpful regarding my own chronic pain puzzles,  especially fascia and bone, and these things seem definitely to be the answer for my longterm, unsolved problems.  This area of knowledge is an area I never heard anything about, even though I had AP physicians thought to be among the best for years. 

Hope this information may be helpful to you and others.  (It is virtually a “repeat” of what I have posted several times over the past 6-12 months — but perhaps a bit more specific for your particular posted three problems.)

Memory & Depression & Pain…. links/info:
 
http://www.jigsawhealth.com/magnesium/Magnesium_Deficiency_Report_Jigsaw_Health.pdf
Page 9, under the paragraph heading STRESS refers to depression, etc.
 
http://www.pbraunmd.org/magnesiu.htm
Page 4 of 12, under Gastrotestinal Disorders paragraph
Page 6 of 12, under How to Diagnose Magnesium Deficiency
Page 6 of 12, paragraph that begins:  “So a trial of magnesium is indicated with any spastic condition…. this sentence includes Raynaud's.  The very next sentence, includes depression and begins: “But vertigo, psychosis, confusion, depression….[etc]….can also be due to magnesium deficiency.  
 

http://www.mdheal.org/magnesiu.htm
 
The short excerpt below not adequate; must read much of article to cover breadth of subject:
 
Galland [42] found a 46% prevalence of MVP in patients being treated for chronic infection with Candida albicans,- these patients all had symptoms of hypersensitivity to Candida, as well as chronic infection. Recently, investigators at The Omega Institute in New Orleans, La., reported an unusually high frequency (96%) of MVP in women with infertility due to pelvic fibroadhesive disease [4]. These observations indicate that the etiology of MVP is much broader than a simple Mendelian dyscollagenosis.

[font=”Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif”]Conclusion
Most features of the MVP syndrome can be attributed to direct physiological effects of Mg-D [ed. note …Magnesium Deficiency; emphasis in blue in this article by AF] or to secondary effects produced by blockade of EFA desaturation. These include valvular collagen dissolution, ventricular hyperkinesis, cardiac arrhythmias, occasional thromboembolic phenomena. autonomic dysregulation and association with LT, pelvic fibrosis, autoimmune disease, anxiety disorders, allergy and chronic candidiasis.

Hypornagnesemic [ed. note…sp?..AF] LT is the commonest metabolic disturbance in patients with MVP. Identification and correction of pre- and postnatal Mg-D may delay or prevent the appearance of the MVP syndrome in genetically prone individuals.

End of references and quoted material. 
[/font]
Dee, not only could the depression and memory problems be caused by magnesium deficiency but also the pain you are experiencing because of high acidic waste levels and low levels of necessary minerals to neutralize these acids so they can be flushed out of the body.   
 
Good luck to you,
AF
 
 

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