Biologics vs Antibiotics

[Sterlingroses]

I have been to three specialists now for Psoriatic Arthritis

Rheumatologist

AP Rheumatologist

Clinical Research Doc in Rheum, Dermatology/Internal medicine

The first and third tell me AP therapy doesn't work and the side effects are worse than the biologics. The reason they say it doesn't work is because antibiotics aren't strong enough to suppress the immune system.

I would like to hear from some of the old timers on these meds.

Thanks

[Suzanne]

I don't think the intent of the abx is to suppress the immune system!

You can research the adverse event warnings of the biologics and antibiotics on http://www.fda.gov.

Mom of teen daughter with Poly JIA since age 2. Current med: azithromycin 250 mg MWF.

[davew]

My understanding is that immune suppression isn't the goal of AP. Killing the bugs, is. So, in my view, Drs# 1& 3 are only saying what backs up their protocol and are expressing what most of us have found to be not what we wanted. Personally I don't want my immune system suppressed, I would like to have it enhanced.

I haven't done biologics, but have done just about everything else and find it difficult to believe that side effects from AP are worse.

[Sterlingroses]

I agree with you. I don't want my immune system compromised either. I just want to figure out the best way to treat this problem. All my blood work comes back normal. The only way I have been diagnosed is through symptoms. I have psoriasis and the digits, extremity swelling. Knee joint fills with fluid and has been drained multiple times.

I guess I am confused about what is actually going to happen on antibiotic therapy. Will my PA stop progressing? WIll it go into remission? Will this stop further joint damage?

The Enbrel (according to some of the docs) stops the progression of the arthritis AND treats the psoriasis. There are other ways to treat the psoriasis and I am looking into those as well. The joint damage is what concerns me along with flares and the pain.

 

[Suzanne]

[user=2098]Sterlingroses[/user] wrote:

I guess I am confused about what is actually going to happen on antibiotic therapy. Will my PA stop progressing? WIll it go into remission? Will this stop further joint damage?

The Enbrel (according to some of the docs) stops the progression of the arthritis AND treats the psoriasis.

 

That is correct that Enbrel is used to treat both conditions.

There is no guarantee on any therapy and that is why these decisions are so personal and individual.

One thing that troubles me is that they had to throw in that they think abx have more risks than biologics.  I think you will feel differently if you read what the FDA has documented.  All drugs have risks, but some drugs have more risks than others.  If you truly need the benefit of a drug, there should be no reason to mislead about the risks.

Mom of teen daughter with Poly JIA since age 2. Current med: azithromycin 250 mg MWF.

[davew]

 I have been on minocycline for about 1 1/2 years I believe and the most severe side effect that I experience is all of the compliments on my great tan… 🙂

I'm not the George Hamilton type, so I find that pretty amusing….

[Maz]

[user=2098]Sterlingroses[/user] wrote:

I guess I am confused about what is actually going to happen on antibiotic therapy. Will my PA stop progressing? WIll it go into remission? Will this stop further joint damage?

 

Hi SterlingRoses,

Just my two cents, but the best way to learn about antibiotic therapy and the rationale for its use is to read the Henry Scammell book, The New Arthritis Breakthrough. Also, get as informed as you can about all the available drugs and their potential side-effects. Then, decide for yourself if it makes better sense to suppress your immune system or to go after root causes. None of us can really convince another to go the AP route…as Suzanne said, it's got to be a personal decision based upon getting informed and empowering one's self to make a choice based on that information.

There are two camps on this issue…the current conventional view that rheumatic disease is idiopathic and the Brown view that rheumatic disease has infectious causes. There is quite a bit of newly emerging research to back up Brown's theories, but important to become familiarized with it all and then to decide what makes most sense to you. AP is not an overnight fix, because these are chronic, slow infections that require longterm therapy to see results and it is a therapy this is a kind of act of faith…until you start seeing results, that is. Just ask Pixelfixer (daughter Hilary with PsA). That said, mild, early disease responds more swiftly to AP than entrenched, longstanding disease where the immune system has been compromised for many years on immunosuppressive therapy.

So, my best suggestion as a fellow patient is get informed, talk to others with PsA who are on AP and then make the decision that is most comfortable to you.

Wishing you all the very best in your decision-making process, Sterling!

Peace, Maz

 

 

[spfister]

I am pretty new to using AP, but I can say from using a biological for RA for 4 years that the side effects for me were very bad.  That isn't to say that would be the case for you.  I got a fungus growing in my lungs and also psuedomonas pneumonia, both which are very serious in themselves.  My pulminologist said that it was from the biological.  Now I am using AP.  Yes the biological worked great,  in  that all my pain disappeared in a couple of days but unfortunately with a price to pay. 

This is just my experience and I haven't been on the AP long enough to say it's made me well (yet).  But from what I have read on this bulletin board it's working for many!

Your doing well in trying to make an informed decision:)

 

[Eva Holloway]

Sterlingroses,

I was on Enbrel and no it did't help, you should seen my hands, I also have Dermatomyositis. My hands are not crippled or deformed, but the Enbrel caused a lot of infections in my body to the point I couldn't walk more than ten or twelfe steps before I had to sit down and rest for several minutes. I was also on Prednison and Cellcept. Before that I was on cytoxen (chemo). Nothing helped all it did made me sick.

If your AP doctor is well versed in his/her bussiness they should be able to help you. Do you have the Road Back book? There is a lot of info there that could help you. AP is not an immune suppressend only the DMARD's and Prednison is and several other meds they use for RA, PsA, DM  etc.

You have to choose what is best for you, but first read up on everything on both sides because there is a lot of things that the FDA has blackboxed on the DMARD's, haven't seen anything on the antibiotic medication. Everyone is different and every doctor that treats RA with antibiotics treats their patients different. Some people do well with IV others just on pills.

Eva:D

Eva Holloway

[Author]

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