Bio-identical Hormones are helping

[Valsmum]

Thanks Lizz,
I did get my progeaterone levels checked for adenomyosis and they were very low and I was deficient. I noticed the progesterone helping as an antiinflammatory. I was taking between 100mg and 200 mg. It REALLy helped my period pain, I couldn’t beleive the difference. My arthritis seemed a little better too. I will definately look into the wiley protocol. Whats werid is how some of us get RA , after having babies. I know I was dxd with RA , 6 weeks postpartum, I beleive in the infectious casue of arthritis, but having a few days of no arthritis pain on progesterone made me rethink how important hormones are too. Esprcially since women tend to get RA, 3times more than men.

I see that you are weaning off of pred, me too, boy is it tedious. Any tips? I am at 7mg and weaning about 1mg a month. Sometimes I take vit. c and a magnesuim supplement, when I feel the side effects of prednisone. Weaning makes me a little grouchy, do you have any recommendations for that? I doubt there is one. Glad the bio-id hormones are helping you, take care.

[Maz]

@Valsmum wrote:

Whats werid is how some of us get RA , after having babies. I know I was dxd with RA , 6 weeks postpartum, I beleive in the infectious casue of arthritis, but having a few days of no arthritis pain on progesterone made me rethink how important hormones are too. Esprcially since women tend to get RA, 3times more than men.

Hi Valsmum,

I don’t know if this will help or not, but during pregnancy, all levels of hormones are increased to quite high levels to help sustain the pregnancy and to prevent fetal rejection. Cortisol almost doubles during the latter part of the pregnancy and this has the same action as taking prednisone, to suppress immune function. You can read about this here, but you’ll probably find better resources online:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cortisol

“Immune system

Cortisol can weaken the activity of the immune system. Cortisol prevents proliferation of T-cells by rendering the interleukin-2 producer T-cells unresponsive to interleukin-1 (IL-1), and unable to produce the T-cell growth factor.[34] Cortisol also has a negative-feedback effect on interleukin-1.[35] IL-1 must be especially useful in combating some diseases; however, endotoxic bacteria have gained an advantage by forcing the hypothalamus to increase cortisol levels (forcing the secretion of CRH hormone, thus antagonizing IL-1). The suppressor cells are not affected by glucosteroid response-modifying factor (GRMF),[36] so the effective setpoint for the immune cells may be even higher than the setpoint for physiological processes (reflecting leukocyte redistribution to lymph nodes, bone marrow, and skin). Rapid administration of corticosterone (the endogenous Type I and Type II receptor agonist) or RU28362 (a specific Type II receptor agonist) to adrenalectomized animals induced changes in leukocyte distribution. Natural killer cells are not affected by cortisol.”

So, in effect, elevated cortisol suppresses and weakens immune function and some endotoxic bugs are even capable of forcing the hypothalmus to increase cortisol to their advantage. What this means, is that when hormone levels crash after pregnancy, that immune suppression is lost very quickly…hence, bugs that were loving this period of lack of immune surveillance suddenly become targeted by the awakening immune system….hence, a post-partum flare. This probably isn’t the only mechanism at work and there are other hormones that are also palliative during pregnancy, because hormones are, after all, sterols, which have similar effects to steroids. Here is some info on Wiki about this…again, probably not the best source of info, but you’ll find more by running further searches:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steroid_hormone

This fits nicely with infectious theory, because although naturally produced hormones have important roles in the body, lack of them can cause problems, including an inability to control inflam. So, supplementing with either synthetic or bio-identical hormones replaces the ones we aren’t producing naturally to provide some really nice palliative effects. However, this doesn’t mean that lack of hormones is the cause of the rheumatic disease….it just means that the effects of the rheumatic disease are felt more when hormones are imbalanced or low and periods of excessive levels of hormones can probably also have detrimental effect, enabling those pathogens who enjoy the lowered immune surveillance, a chance to proliferate.

This is just a guess on my part, following the dots, but fluctuating, imbalanced and lowered hormone levels, with elevated cortisol (chronic stress due to illness or daily life) could well be the reason why women suffer more allergies and hypersensitivities in mid-life (Brown thought that RA was caused by “bacterial allergy” to endotoxins released by offending bugs) than men is because they lose the protective and palliative effects of higher levels of hormones when they suddenly go through menopause or have just had a baby. This and a high pathogen load, certain genetic proclivities,toxic environmental exposures and inability to detox effectively, leaky gut, etc. probably all add up to the perfect storm. Men don’t experience this change of life quite so dramatically and so their immune systems aren’t as upset or as susceptible to hypersensitivity reactions due to the more gradual changes they go through. Their higher testosterone levels probably also afford greater immune support.

Cortisol does seem to be a pretty important and maybe even a pivotal hormone in rheumatic disease as it’s also produced in response to “fight or flight”…so many people comment on how their rheumatic disease began after pregnancy, a period of prolonged stress, a car accident, a surgery, an illness or bad infection, the death of a loved one, etc. So, while the body is stressed, cortisol levels rise to try to bring homeostasis to the body again. However, in the process, if a person has a brewing infection, the infection gets to enjoy this period of immune suppression and then all sorts of other factors come into play to produce the initial flare of the rheumatic disease.

Just sharing some dots that seem to be coming together for after discovering I had high cortisol levels and that this may be something that has been delaying my progress. So, I’m doing some things to support my adrenals right now and get them back on track.

So glad to hear you feel so much better, Lizz. 🙂

[Lizz]

Hi Valsmum, I wish I had a magic way (pain free) to get off prednisone, but I don’t have the answer. I usually take 2- 2.5 mgs per day, a very low dose. At my peak of pain, I never took over 7 mgs., and that was just one day. I think once you get to 3mgs or less, you should approach this slowly over an extended period of time, as at this dose the adrenals are awake. I am going to ask my Dr. next time about cortef – a more-natural form of cortisone, which Dr. Teitlebaum talks about in his book, Pain Free 1-2-3, that I have dog-eared over the last couple of years. He is heavily into fibromyalgia treatment, as he had it himself. He talks about natural ways to ease inflammation which is very helpful. I hope you get some answers and are on your way to feeling better!

Maz- Thanks for your best wishes and I hope you continue to improve.

Lizz

[Valsmum]

Thanks Maz,
The articles make a lot of sense to me, thanks for the links and putting the dots together. I am going to look into progesterone being an immune modulator too and read up on it. For any lady here with frightfully painful periods I would suggest getting your hormones checked. I don’t know why I waited so long, with the progesterone I have no period pain, I only take it 10 days a month.

Thanks agin Lizz,
Glad you are doing better. I am happy to be weaning at a rate of 1mg a month, my sed rate is finally in normal range, thanks to a year of minocycline and my “no starch diet”. For me, food really affects my arthritis, hopefully my gut will heal and someday I can eat whatever I want.

[cavalier]

What I remember is that during PG Progesterone levels rise to keep the baby & it does the same thing for sure in Female canines – it spikes during their season & as the season climbs & they ovulate it spikes up even higher & stays up for a bit even after the season wanes if the female dog gets PG it continues to stay high until the gestation period & nursing period is over – not just the birth of the pups but upon weaning of the pups.

When a woman who has a autoimmune condition like Lupus or Scleroderma many med. articles cite that the PG woman if she continues successfully to stay PG generally her auto immune condition gets better – sometimes in Lupus it can get worse but this is the exception not the rule – the articles i read cite the credit to being progesterone as being the helper and when the immune is in overdrive or dysregulation progesterone can be a immune modulator. A hormone imbalance in either humans or canines can & is a big factor to the whole picture of how autoimmune diseases can get a foot hold & also in bacterial infections coming on or getting worse. So much so that some articles suggest checking hormone balance along with treating bacterial infections if one is going to get better & help the immune do it’s job. Certainly during growth tee age yr’s or menopause hormones can get out of synch or too low.

Like Maz I have high cortisol low progesterone & am high end of testerone.
I was told by a doc recently that stressed adrenals are common to SD patients & it is seconadry to the disease.
I use Drenamin by Standard Process & Designs for health Adrenotone to help the adrenals the body being stressed & reacting to stress for so long also takes it toll.

I am on bioidentical Progesterone &I take DHEA to try to help support my immune etc.

Jill

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