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Please see below and advise. Thanks
Really? Doesn’t this go against the whole theory then that RA and other diagnoses are caused by infectious causes and not the immune system attacking itself? I am on IgG2000 prescribed by a functional medicine doctor in order to boost my immune system against Lyme and RA and I can definitely see an improvement. I am down to 3 mg of prednisone and doing well. I am sleeping better, have more energy and haven’t had any major flareups for a couple of months.
ReesaK[/quote]
Hi Reesak:
Well, i am still learning about all this, but from what i have learned this would not necessarily be the case. The AI could be caused by an infection, but once you have the infection and trying to use AP to resolve it using anything to boost te immunity system may had flames to the fire. I am going to create a new post to invite the more experienced members to comment on this, because I have looked at LDN, but have passed on this and other things for now because of this concern. i appear to be getting better and do not want to trigger a relapse.
@Fliptop wrote:
the AI that you are talking about is the artificial intelligence?
i cannot get what the AI means.?
AI is Autoimmune. I goofed on the shorthand.
Hi Flip;
You just gave me my laugh for the day.Artificial Intelligence…hehehe.Some of us are so brain dead(brain fog) from these diseases that any intelligence is welcome.AI means auto immune.O.K MM my son…I always wanted a boy to add to the family and you just got nominated.I know my English is not very good so if I confuse you please let me know.Also ,you are just starting this learning curve that seems to have a lot of kinks in it instead of a nice arc.
You really have to do everything you can to get your immune system to function properly.You know that it was probably the Lyme that knocked it to it’s knees and then SD came in for the second round and you really want to get it working before something else hits like thyroid or diabetes or cancer.If you did some digging around on the Marshall protocol site you might have run into some pictures of what our immune cells look like once they are colonized by micoplasma, freaked me out! I guess you could then say that our immune cells are attacking themselves because the micos are inside them.Actually we have sick immune systems and AI is not really a good term.
You also must remember that it is not the antibiotics that do the killing,they just weaken the bacteria and it is your immune system that does the killing if it is strong enough.This is one of the reasons that proper diet is sooooooooooo important.
Any time you are unsure of something there is always someone here to help you.I know I would be 6 feet under if not for the help of some old timers here.
LynnePLease see below prior inquiry and would really apptreciate more responses to inquiry.
@MINOCINMAN wrote:
Please see below and advise. Thanks
Really? Doesn’t this go against the whole theory then that RA and other diagnoses are caused by infectious causes and not the immune system attacking itself? I am on IgG2000 prescribed by a functional medicine doctor in order to boost my immune system against Lyme and RA and I can definitely see an improvement. I am down to 3 mg of prednisone and doing well. I am sleeping better, have more energy and haven’t had any major flareups for a couple of months.
ReesaK
Hi Reesak:
Well, i am still learning about all this, but from what i have learned this would not necessarily be the case. The AI could be caused by an infection, but once you have the infection and trying to use AP to resolve it using anything to boost te immunity system may had flames to the fire. I am going to create a new post to invite the more experienced members to comment on this, because I have looked at LDN, but have passed on this and other things for now because of this concern. i appear to be getting better and do not want to trigger a relapse.[/quote]
The problem is that the question cannot really be answered easily because it’s too vague. The immune system is complex. Because of that, phrases like “immune boosting” or “boosting the immune system” are meaningless because they don’t tell us what part of the immune system is being stimulated. The best answer one can give to that question is, “It depends.” For example, if a person’s immune system is out of balance and is stimulated in such a way that it becomes even more unbalanced, that is bad. But if it is stimulated in such a way that it becomes balanced, or less unbalanced, that is a good thing. Make sense?
Phil
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth."
- Albert EinsteinHi, Is this stuff IgG2000 really that good since I have not found any reviews on it from RA sufferers on the web. It is very expensive and the professional (?) formula is only available though licensed physicians. How many people here are on it?
The most interesting part of this formual is the word GI inflammation. This is what I suffer from most and that is ther reason my RA flares up everytime my stomach gets inflammed for no reason at all. So far the only thing that works on calming it down is L-glutamine. NAC and Vitamin C(even buffered) irritates my stomach and causes RA to flare most of the time.
@PhilC wrote:
The problem is that the question cannot really be answered easily because it’s too vague. The immune system is complex. Because of that, phrases like “immune boosting” or “boosting the immune system” are meaningless because they don’t tell us what part of the immune system is being stimulated. The best answer one can give to that question is, “It depends.” For example, if a person’s immune system is out of balance and is stimulated in such a way that it becomes even more unbalanced, that is bad. But if it is stimulated in such a way that it becomes balanced, or less unbalanced, that is a good thing.
Hi MinocinMan,
I’ll second Phil’s comments.
In the case of LDN, for example, my understanding is that it is not boosting immune function…it is boosting endorphin release, which then modulates immune function. This is much like the release of endorphins when working out, which lends itself to improving and strengthening immune function.
The way my layman’s mind pictures “autoimmunity” is that the immune system is on hyper-drive, but not in an idiopathic sense. If one adheres to infectious theory, then the immune system is doing exactly what it’s supposed to be doing…going after infections. The trouble is, these infections are intracellular and, in the case of some infections, hidden, with sneaky cloaking devices that enable them to mimic our own cells’ outer surface proteins (molecular mimickry). Some will call in reinforcements, like morphing into abx resistant cystic forms or seek protection in bio-film communities. They’re still releasing their nasty toxins and alerting the immune system to foreign invaders, but the immune system can’t find the actual bug, because it has morphed, camelion-like, into the background scenery of our own cells or has moved on to greener pastures in the body. Therefore, the immune system goes after the toxin chem-trail these bugs leave in their wake, spread over our own cells, and our own tissues become the collateral damage. So, yes, the immune system is on hyperdrive and is in a “self-attacking” mode, but not in any idiopathic way. Mother nature is smart and I doubt very much we were designed to attack ourselves for no good reason.
Another way I imagine it is that the immune system in this kind of scenario is a bit like a marathon runner near the finish line, but dazed and confused from the long run (exhaustive search for intracellular infections and/or infections with cloaking devices), unable to locate that finish ribbon and the refreshment tables (bacterial toxins) along the way have become a distraction.
Phil is right…care should be taken in adding anything that might boost some aspect of immune function that creates or adds to further imbalance, just as one would want to avoid dampening immune function, if at all possible, but “modulation” is a different thing. Minocycline has some tremendous immune-modulating effects, which you’ve most likely already researched along the way.
Glad to hear you feel you’re on an improvement trend, MinocinMan. This is still very early days for you, so this is quite remarkable if you’re noticing improvements already! Congrats!
Phil & Maz:
Thank you for your comments.
@Maz wrote:
@PhilC wrote:
The problem is that the question cannot really be answered easily because it’s too vague. The immune system is complex. Because of that, phrases like “immune boosting” or “boosting the immune system” are meaningless because they don’t tell us what part of the immune system is being stimulated. The best answer one can give to that question is, “It depends.” For example, if a person’s immune system is out of balance and is stimulated in such a way that it becomes even more unbalanced, that is bad. But if it is stimulated in such a way that it becomes balanced, or less unbalanced, that is a good thing.
Hi MinocinMan,
I’ll second Phil’s comments.
In the case of LDN, for example, my understanding is that it is not boosting immune function…it is boosting endorphin release, which then modulates immune function. This is much like the release of endorphins when working out, which lends itself to improving and strengthening immune function.
The way my layman’s mind pictures “autoimmunity” is that the immune system is on hyper-drive, but not in an idiopathic sense. If one adheres to infectious theory, then the immune system is doing exactly what it’s supposed to be doing…going after infections. The trouble is, these infections are intracellular and, in the case of some infections, hidden, with sneaky cloaking devices that enable them to mimic our own cells’ outer surface proteins (molecular mimickry). Some will call in reinforcements, like morphing into abx resistant cystic forms or seek protection in bio-film communities. They’re still releasing their nasty toxins and alerting the immune system to foreign invaders, but the immune system can’t find the actual bug, because it has morphed, camelion-like, into the background scenery of our own cells or has moved on to greener pastures in the body. Therefore, the immune system goes after the toxin chem-trail these bugs leave in their wake, spread over our own cells, and our own tissues become the collateral damage. So, yes, the immune system is on hyperdrive and is in a “self-attacking” mode, but not in any idiopathic way. Mother nature is smart and I doubt very much we were designed to attack ourselves for no good reason.
Another way I imagine it is that the immune system in this kind of scenario is a bit like a marathon runner near the finish line, but dazed and confused from the long run (exhaustive search for intracellular infections and/or infections with cloaking devices), unable to locate that finish ribbon and the refreshment tables (bacterial toxins) along the way have become a distraction.
Phil is right…care should be taken in adding anything that might boost some aspect of immune function that creates or adds to further imbalance, just as one would want to avoid dampening immune function, if at all possible, but “modulation” is a different thing. Minocycline has some tremendous immune-modulating effects, which you’ve most likely already researched along the way.
Glad to hear you feel you’re on an improvement trend, MinocinMan. This is still very early days for you, so this is quite remarkable if you’re noticing improvements already! Congrats!
I’m reading all this stuff and I have concluded due to my massive success in feeling a million times better. 98% better i would calculate that balancing the immune system is the most important aspect of AP. We all take probiotics right? well what if I told you that you could be doing more harm good by taking the wrong ones? My naturopath enlightened me to this idea and she showed me a probiotic that actually balances the immune system. our immune system primarily runs through our gut so having healthy bacteria that balance both aspects of immune function namely T1 and T2 regulators. if your probiotic only boosts one of these it will throw the other one out of wack. if your T1 dominates your T2 it will result in mass loads of inflammation. if your T2 is out of wack you will get condiotions such as asthma, allergies, eczema, rhinitus the whole lot. I will post a very informative article i found on the web that specifically mentions the probiotic i take. i use to take a crappy one from jameson that did next to nothing but i truly believe that the one i take now is the ferrari of probiotics. the product is ProBio SAP-90, its kinda expensive but i think its worth the bang for your buck. if you can snake your way through the science mumbojumbo of this article i find that you will agree. OUR IMMUNE SYSTEM STARTS IN THE TUMMY!! 🙂 thanks for listening hope i helped you people. oh and ive been on minocycline pulse dosed for 2 months almost now and I have been pain free for aprox 5 weeks 🙂 i really feel as though i have my life back now.
http://www.intjnm.org/admin/article/Leah_Gillingham,_David_Lescheid_.pdf
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