Freezing!

[laurawm]

Hi Everyone,

Does anyone know why the body has such bouts of coldness/low body temperature with autoimmune disease? Does this serve any kind of protective or helpful immune function during flaring/herxing or is it purely a negative immune response?

Last night I could.not.get.warm when trying to go to sleep. The thermostat was set at 74 degrees and it was around 60 degrees outside. I had two heavy quilts/comforters on the bed and winter PJs. Could.not.get.warm. I have a long history with this off and on but of course I notice it more now that I know I have RA. I’ve tried a heating pad etc. but ultimately I’ve found that when the heating pad goes off, my body just gets cold again and does not self regulate. The best solution I’ve found is piling on clothes and blankets and turning the thermostat up and just waiting it out (for an hour last night). Just wanting some feedback if anyone knows what the body is trying to do or why this happens as I’m not especially looking forward to colder temps coming soon?

warmth and peace,
laura

[richie]

Hi Its called Raynauds -Common in many rheumatic illnesses –treated with a calcium channel blocker –
richie

[Maz]

Hi Laura,

How is your thyroid doing at the moment? Noted you’re taking T3…any labs recently to check thryoid levels and also other hormones?

Also, have you had fibrinogen levels checked? Do you take systemic enzymes?

How often do you use your infrared sauna? Have you found that using it during an attack helps?

How are your RA and inflam numbers looking?

[laurawm]

Hi Maz!

Overall, I am doing better – more functional, less fatigued etc.. However, I have not had labs done since June but am due back at my LLPA’s in the next couple of weeks. I have upped some of my protocol dosages this last week, though, and started back more regularly with the sauna, so perhaps it is herxing? I definitely still have daily ups and downs in how I feel. I don’t know much about my fibrinogen levels so I’ll look into that, but I definitely do take a multitude of enzymes everyday – they make a big difference for me. -Not sure what happened last night. I went out for sushi, and the rice is not on my diet, but no soy sauce and lots of probiotics so it doesn’t quite add up. I have been reducing my LDN because I’ve had a long stretch on nightmares that I know might have something to do with LDN.

Thanks for everything, Maz.

Richie, you think it’s all a circulation/inflammation issue associated with Raynaud’s? The actual feeling of coldness and lower body temperature?

Laura

[PhilC]

Hi Laura,

Have you checked your temperature to make sure it’s normal? When I am running a fever I feel like I am freezing, but I also feel cold if my body temperature is a little low. In any case, I have experienced what you described many times in the past, but not recently. About a year ago I started putting about one to two tablespoons of coconut oil in the oatmeal that I usually eat for breakfast, and the problem immediately went away. By the way, I’ve found that eating coconut oil near bedtime is likely to cause insomnia because of the stimulating effect it has on one’s metabolism.

Phil

"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth."
- Albert Einstein

[A Friend]

@laurawm wrote:

Hi Everyone,

Does anyone know why the body has such bouts of coldness/low body temperature with autoimmune disease? Does this serve any kind of protective or helpful immune function during flaring/herxing or is it purely a negative immune response?

Last night I could.not.get.warm when trying to go to sleep. The thermostat was set at 74 degrees and it was around 60 degrees outside. I had two heavy quilts/comforters on the bed and winter PJs. Could.not.get.warm. I have a long history with this off and on but of course I notice it more now that I know I have RA. I’ve tried a heating pad etc. but ultimately I’ve found that when the heating pad goes off, my body just gets cold again and does not self regulate. The best solution I’ve found is piling on clothes and blankets and turning the thermostat up and just waiting it out (for an hour last night). Just wanting some feedback if anyone knows what the body is trying to do or why this happens as I’m not especially looking forward to colder temps coming soon?

warmth and peace,
laura

Hi Laura,
During the first year or two that I’d begun this chronic illness journey (before I knew anything about Dr. Brown’s work and AP), I would become ill and be given 10 days of antibiotics, and feel better for several months — then start over again. This repeated itself so many times over two years, helping only temporarily each time.

During the above period of time, I still vividly remember feeling cold to the bone (especially during the winter indoors), regardless of what I was wearing. During that time, I discovered that if I took an Ibuprofen, it helped considerably and I would begin feeling warmer. In this case, I feel it helped warm me because my circulation seemed to increase. In Dr. Brown’s work and related research I read later, it showed some good properties of Ibuprofen — one is addressing inflammation.

Also, during that time, I would sometimes feel like I had a temperature; but, when I would check it with a thermometer, it generally appeared below normal. (I would later realize that some of those times, I probably did have a rise in temperature; but with my temperature being sub-normal to begin with, the elevation went unnoticed because of the low starting point of taking the temperature. Not only do I believe, in my case, circulation was affected, but probably also the thyroid had become involved.

My whole life I’d always been very active physically, healthy, and no thyroid problems, I believe the above problems were all related to what had happened to my body after the onset of this illness — triggered by a long period of time when I had a TMJ diagnosis… that turned out to be a long-simmering jaw bone infection that followed replacement of a crown in a back jawtooth. After being RXed abx about 15 times those two years, my belief is that this resulted in a widespread fungal overgrowth, because the abx had wiped out all my good flora, and the unfriendly organisms left had a “field day” multiplying in my body.

Hope you find answers and help and get better soon. I believe you can and will!!!

AF

[laurawm]

Thanks Phil and AF,

I just took my temperature and it says 97.8. I generally run between 96 and 98 something – low. I do know that my average temp overall is better than it was even 5-8 years ago when I always ran a “normal” temp of 96.8 rather than vice versa. Sometimes I now actually get a true “normal” reading – but still ten to run a bit cool. I also always feel super cold when I have a fever, so perhaps this was part of it. But as the weekend has gone on, it’s apparent that I am reacting to likely to both lowering my LDN (cut my 4.5mg dose in half – no more nightmares – yay) and upping my salt/C dose as I am having a standard herx (intense flaring joints, diarrhea, itching, fatigue and then relief after detoxing). So, perhaps I just need to slow things down a bit.

I do appreciate the feedback about ibuprofen and coconut oil. I’ve tried to stay away from NSAIDs because I have such a severely leaky gut and I know NSAIDS can contribute to perpetuating this by inhibiting the prostaglandins that the body uses to regenerate and repair the gut linging – though I have been planning on adding more white willow bark (natural aspirin) into my supplements, so hopefully that will help to some degree with less effect on my gut due to the natural tannins. I do take the equivalent of about 1 tablespoon of coconut oil a day and would like to take more – but this is my current tolerance level. I think monolaurin (coconut lauric acid supplement) is really effective and helpful, but I can’t take a great deal at this point. There is no doubt in my mind about my fungal and bacterial issues as driving forces in my disease, I just have to go about things creatively as treating both requires a very holistic approach! Overall, getting inflammation and CRP further down will solve my temp issues I’m sure, I just like to understand what’s going on in my body so I know what direction to go – all of this feedback helps.

Thanks again!

Laura

[A Friend]

@laurawm wrote:

Thanks Phil and AF,

…..as I am having a standard herx (intense flaring joints, diarrhea, itching, fatigue and then relief after detoxing). I also personally suspect that LDN has some immunosuppressive properties, so I believe there is an element of my immune system being freed up with the lowered dose. So, perhaps I just need to slow things down a bit.

I do appreciate the feedback about ibuprofen and coconut oil. I’ve tried to stay away from NSAIDs because I have such a severely leaky gut and I know NSAIDS can contribute to perpetuating this by inhibiting the prostaglandins that the body uses to regenerate and repair the gut linging – though I have been planning on adding more white willow bark (natural aspirin) into my supplements, so hopefully that will help to some degree with less effect on my gut due to the natural tannins. I do take the equivalent of about 1 tablespoon of coconut oil a day and would like to take more – but this is my current tolerance level. I think monolaurin (coconut lauric acid supplement) is really effective and helpful, but I can’t take a great deal at this point. There is no doubt in my mind about my fungal and bacterial issues as driving forces in my disease, I just have to go about things creatively as treating both requires a very holistic approach! Overall, getting inflammation and CRP further down will solve my temp issues I’m sure, I just like to understand what’s going on in my body so I know what direction to go – all of this feedback helps.
Laura

Laura,
I, too, shy away from taking NSAIDS, but found an occasional ibuprofen as an anti-inflammatory, and helping my blood circulation when I was cold, worked really well for me and quickly; and when I do need it, one usually addresses what I’ve taken it for. I believe Dr. Brown may have mentioned its use in his book. I’m lucky that I don’t usually have headaches, etc. and feel a need to take such as Advil, etc. which really is hard on your stomach. Have you considered adding Silymarin/Milk Thistle to your regimen? It is known to be helpful to the liver in dealing more effectively with toxin elimination.

Dr. Wm Crook’s book titled, “Chronic Fatigue & the Yeast Connection” years ago gave very effective suggestions for dealing with yeast/fungal overgrowth using various supplements. Once yeast/fungal overgrowth has gotten a foothold in the body, it apparently can invade many areas and become an unseen enemy. I’ve had to be vigilant about this(as I’ve never seen overt signs) after coming to the realization of how serious this problem can be, and how much damage it did in the past.

Don’t know whether your supplement schedule allows room for such as nondenatured whey protein (such as ImmunoPro), but this product can address unfriendly organisms and even those that cause abnormal lab tests denoting infection. You may have read one of my old posts about a severe reaction to two pulsed abx (my liver rebelled!), and having to get off all abx at that time. Since the abnormal lab needed addressing, I added the nondenatured whey protein for six months per Dr. Cheney’s research (with no abx) and my AP physician retested at the end of 6 months, and the abnormal lab was normal on the test. (If I have a need for Minocin, I will again take it, and have a comfort knowing it is there; but, for the last year or more, the nondenatured whey protein seems to be doing the job.)

Sounds like you are doing a good job. Good luck to you.

AF

[Rosey UK]

I have extreme coldness, like cold threw to bones. Like Maz says have you have to get your thyroid checked? I have under active thyroid, I also have raynauds like Richie mentions. The worst was when I had fevers, freezing cold shaking but feel reallyhot to my husband.
Now the only thing that warms me up is PARACETAMOL. Even if I’m having a fever the paracetamol is the thing.
Good luck!
Rosemary

[laurawm]

Thanks AF and Rosey. AF, you make a good point that I could take Ibuprofen or aspirin just when I’m having a cold spell and I’m sure it wouldn’t do any harm. I’ve also heard and read about the good aspects of whey – I can’t tolerate casein, though, so I’m not sure how whey would work for me. I can tolerate colostrum and still take this daily. My LLPA has been trying to get me to add straight lactoferrin, I just haven’t simply because I have so many supplements already.

Rosey – I am due to have my thyroid checked again – it has been low since I’ve been sick, but I was hoping that it was beginning to normalize as I have been less fatigued – we’ll see. I’m really sorry you’ve not been feeling well and hope you find some relief soon!

Thanks again – will take something the next time I’m freezing and see how it helps me. (:

Laura

[Woods1977]

Hi Laura,

My post isn’t going to be helpful, other than the fact that like you, I absolutely cannot get warm- so you’re not alone! I’m probably the only person on the face of the earth that would gladly sit in a car with the windows rolled up on a 90 degree day! I am absolutely dreading the impending Michigan winter… It’s like my bones are cold- I can’t explain it. My husband and I constantly fight about the thermostat in the car; I’m quite sure he’s going to push me out of the vehicle one of these days… My Thyroid is perfectly fine (I’ve been tested twice in the last 6 months). For me, I think it’s just another joy of having RA… **sigh**.

[laurawm]

Thanks, Woods. It happened again last night. Very frustrating – I haven’t had this kind of coldness much since last winter. I’ve gone back on my full dose of LDN. I researched it a little more and apparently increasing a host of endorphins is very helpful to a struggling immune system – I know LDN didn’t do much for you, but it seems to make a very significant difference in my case. I need to keep some NSAIDs and water near my bed and then maybe I can get some sleep when this happens again! Or better yet, take all my supplements and meds earlier so I’m not herxing so deeply when I go to sleep – upping my salt/C for four days in a row really shook me up – back down again for now, but I can tell I made some gains, so happy about that.

Best always,
Laura

[roserd2]

Hello Laura,
there is actually a very simple way of warming up your body.

Reynauds is actually is a hyper-activation of the sympathetic nervous system causing extreme vaso-constriction of the peripheral blood vessels, leading to tissue hypoxia.
Meaning your blood vessels constrict and your hands and feet etc. and your cells get very little oxygen to carry out their work and produce the heat by doing so.

The simple and most natural way to dilate your blood vessels is through breathing.
CO2 (carbon dioxide) is a very powerful vasodilator (meaning it makes your blood vessels wider) and therefore you can get more oxygen to your cells again.
If you breath to fast and shallow, you breath out more CO2 then you should. It is sometimes a very subtle hyperventilating that people do. Low CO2 will make your red blood cells take up less oxygen too. They need to unload CO2 to upload oxygen and bring it to the cells. If there is no CO2 to unload then you get less oxygen transport per breath to your cells. People actually can be short of breath by breathing faster and more shallow, then when they briefly hold their breath after exhaling and slowly and steadily breath in again their shortness of breath feeling disappears after a few times doing this.

So next time you fell cold and clammy, try this:
Lay still and watch your breathing. Breathe in and out normally, then pause for about 6-10 seconds, slowly count to 6 or even to 10 if you can do it comfortably…do not force yourself. Do not gasp for air! You just pause long enough to be still comfortable then you breath in as normal as you can and exhale as normal as you can. Again pause and so on.
What will happen is this: Your blood vessels will widen due to the accumulated CO2, your red blood cells will be able to take CO2 up and unload it in your lungs in exchange for oxygen (this is called the Bohr effect – google it if you like) slowly you will notice that your cells are getting more oxygen and start doing their work, meaning they will produce heat by working and your body will warm up.

You can practice this anytime as it will improve things overall.
Here some links if you are interested:

http://www.amsa.org/healingthehealer/breathing.cfm
http://www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/Breathing.html

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