Home Forums General Discussion Wow. Mono virus linked to autoimmune disease

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  • #461830
    CMS12
    Participant
    #461841
    Spiffy1
    Moderator

    I was aware of this cconnection, but it is nice to be reminded. Just like all the other possible triggers, my EBV titers were through the roof…like in the 800’s. I was never aware that I even had mono growing up. The only titer that was not all that high was the one for a current infection. So there was really not that much that was accomplished in finding out these numbers except to brag to friends that my numbers were higher than theirs😂😂😂 The best part of this article was the fact that they think they might can manipulate the EBNA2 to potentially negate the troublesome autoimmune side effects. Thanks for sharing.

    Flare fall of 2014...muscle aches, joint pains, fatigue, hair loss, rashes, etc.
    RA Factor 71 in Jan 2015 down to 25 as of September 2017
    DR4/DQ8 HLA...biotoxin illness
    IGG food allergy to wheat, egg, and dairy...probably all grains
    Vit. C&D, probiotics, milk thistle, turmeric, fish oil, methyl b 12, methyl folate, digestive enzymes, Candisol, Ubiquinol, berberine, chlorella, Moducare, LDN, monolaurin, Triphala, Patriot Greens, Paractin
    MTHFR compound heterozygous
    Igenex IGM positive Lyme, minoMWF

    #461844
    Pinkmoth
    Keymaster

    Interesting….
    I had mono about 17 years ago and I know for certain I have never felt the same since. That illness marked the end of me being a really energetic person. Always thought that was strange, but attributed to the fact that doctors told me the virus never really leaves your body and lives on in your blood forever, just in reduced numbers.

    Thanks for sharing.

    Autoimmune: ANA positive speckled. Probable MCTD with SD overlap. Hashimoto's. Possible Erlos Danlos. Mold Illness.
    Infections: Bartonella, toxoplasmosis, mycoplasma, EBV
    Meds: minocycline (Zydus generic) 100mg 1x daily,
    Supps: digestive enzymes, Monolaurin, Betaine hydrochloric acid, iron, quercetin, biocidin

    #461893
    Maz
    Keymaster

    It’s kind of interesting to research how viruses and bacteria can co-exist intracellularly in the host’s cells. Both survive by parasitizing the host cell and use different cell machinery to reproduce. The MSIDs model – “mixed systemic infections disease syndrome” – is probably the most accurate one to describe the autoimmune infectious process simply because human beings are more bug than human…the bugs outnumber our own cells by 10:1 and in healthy individuals, these bugs live harmoniously and symbiotically in and on us until some dastardly bug tips the apple cart. Perhaps it’s a bacterial or viral infection that infects phagocytes…the human cells that engulf and digest microbes and their debris. What’s a human cell to do when this happens? The very mechanism used by the body to fight infections becomes seriously compromised. The well-honed immune system sees the bugs toxins but is helpless to go after them and begins to attack the foreign proteins it sees that are in or slathering toxins on host cells and the host cells become the collateral damage in the attack – voila – autoimmunity.

    My best layperson’s guess is that the answer isn’t as simple as one infection, but that when the apple cart gets too full of toxins (environmental and microbial), it’s a microbial cesspool of opportunistic bugs running for the land grab. It’s probably not ideal for any researcher to assume one bug drives autoimmunity…perhaps one bug tips an overfull apple cart, but these bugs thrive in biofilm colonies and may well be serving one another for mutual survival. The sickest patients are typically coinfected. Dr. Brown’s research focus was mycoplasma but, during his time, he was well aware of numerous infectious contenders, tested for, and treated them with multiple classes of antibiotics. In some cases, viruses might be identified as the most virulent contender, requiring separate treatment, but someone who is already severely immune-compromised by a virus (e.g., AIDS), usually has to also fend off multiple other infections. What if it’s the viral and microbial combo that overwhelms host immunity? Brown mentioned in the book that AIDS patients are incapable of getting RA…in light of the fact that the virus takes out immunity.

    It’s all so complex to contemplate, isn’t it? No wonder researchers are still focused on identifying “the one” bug! Hopefully human genome projects will gradually unravel the mystery.

    #461894
    lemons
    Participant

    There are a few articles in the press today, one I read was in the Telegraph linking a bacteria spread by sheep to the onset of MS.

    #461895
    Maz
    Keymaster

    Thanks, lemons! Very interesting to see yet more research come out to validate Dr. Brown’s theory of microbial toxins creating bacterial hypersensitivity resulting in chronic inflammation that leads to tissue damage…in this case, the nervous system.

    Exposure to sheep could trigger multiple sclerosis, study suggests

    “Experts have suggested that the immune system may overreact to the toxin, or fail to turn off, leading it to begin attacking healthy cells in the body.”

    In this article, researchers hope to create a vaccine to put MS into the history annals, but so many questions pop to mind!!!! E.g., how would they identify which people to vaccinate or would the vaccine be administered to everyone at birth?

    #461899
    Spiffy1
    Moderator

    Maz, I read the article within the sheep article about killing off the immune system with chemotherapy. It did not work for everyone but some went into complete remission with MS. I wonder if the same would hold true for RA? Could the immune system have no memory of attacking joints and other organs? Interesting.

    Flare fall of 2014...muscle aches, joint pains, fatigue, hair loss, rashes, etc.
    RA Factor 71 in Jan 2015 down to 25 as of September 2017
    DR4/DQ8 HLA...biotoxin illness
    IGG food allergy to wheat, egg, and dairy...probably all grains
    Vit. C&D, probiotics, milk thistle, turmeric, fish oil, methyl b 12, methyl folate, digestive enzymes, Candisol, Ubiquinol, berberine, chlorella, Moducare, LDN, monolaurin, Triphala, Patriot Greens, Paractin
    MTHFR compound heterozygous
    Igenex IGM positive Lyme, minoMWF

    #461903
    Maz
    Keymaster

    Hi Spiffy,

    It’s quite a humongous procedure to go through unfortunately. Fully ablating the immune system can be pretty treacherous and usually certain criteria need to be met to enter such a study – e.g., Patients have to have failed conventional meds, their heart, lungs and other vital organs need to be in strong enough shape, age is a factor, cancer history, etc. In other words, the procedure to wipe out one’s immune system can be deadly so they have to be sure the patient can withstand it first.

    In all honesty, I’m not sure they’ve got enough data yet to be sure that an individual’s immune memory is permanently wiped clean and there can be serious sequalae from heavy chemotherapy down the road. I think even if they found a vaccine for RA tomorrow, touted as a cure, I’d wait for a good 5 or more years before deciding to try it….I’d wait for long term outcome data to be published. That’s just me, however…for folks who have little hope of any quality of life, the decision would likely be much easier to make.

    Dr. Burt at Feinberg in Chicago has been running these trials for autoimmune patients for years, but I haven’t yet researched his long term outcome data…e.g., if anyone relapsed and how many didn’t make it past the immune ablation stage.

    #461958
    Linda L
    Participant

    . In the United States, about half of all five-year-old children and about 90 percent of adults have evidence of previous infection,

    It is what Wikipedia says. How come five-year-old are already infected with EBV? I wished I knew whose kiss it was, ha, ha.
    Many children are infected but don’t have any symptoms. Is it possible that this virus starts multiplying and becomes more dangerous? But it is difficult to believe that so many people have it and many don’t have any symptoms.

    RA tried everything: Methotraxate, Arava, Humira. Pneumonia three times. Anemia. Very low iron. Hypothyroidism
    AP from April 2014 till August 2015. No luck.
    Current medications: Natural thyroid, Mobic, supplements,
    vitamins and minerals.
    MTHFR heterozygous

    #461963
    Spiffy1
    Moderator

    I heard that 95% of the world’s population has been affected. So in some ways I wonder how they know that this is a factor with autoimmune issues. Maybe it is just a bystander like so many of the other viruses/bacteria we all have. I mean, 1 out of 100 people get RA but 95 our of hundred have EBV titers. I do find it most interesting. So if they test autoimmune people and say one thing they share in common is EBV titers, so does the healthy population. Thoughts?
    Probably has something to do with the ye old HLA pattern we are born with.

    Flare fall of 2014...muscle aches, joint pains, fatigue, hair loss, rashes, etc.
    RA Factor 71 in Jan 2015 down to 25 as of September 2017
    DR4/DQ8 HLA...biotoxin illness
    IGG food allergy to wheat, egg, and dairy...probably all grains
    Vit. C&D, probiotics, milk thistle, turmeric, fish oil, methyl b 12, methyl folate, digestive enzymes, Candisol, Ubiquinol, berberine, chlorella, Moducare, LDN, monolaurin, Triphala, Patriot Greens, Paractin
    MTHFR compound heterozygous
    Igenex IGM positive Lyme, minoMWF

    #461964
    Maz
    Keymaster

    One thing that pops to mind is the coinfection scenario. Viruses are known to infect bacteria (called bacteriophages), so bacteria that are mutated by viral DNA are likely more pathogenic to humans than not:

    How viruses infect bacteria: A tale of a tail

    #461965
    Spiffy1
    Moderator

    Most interesting.

    Flare fall of 2014...muscle aches, joint pains, fatigue, hair loss, rashes, etc.
    RA Factor 71 in Jan 2015 down to 25 as of September 2017
    DR4/DQ8 HLA...biotoxin illness
    IGG food allergy to wheat, egg, and dairy...probably all grains
    Vit. C&D, probiotics, milk thistle, turmeric, fish oil, methyl b 12, methyl folate, digestive enzymes, Candisol, Ubiquinol, berberine, chlorella, Moducare, LDN, monolaurin, Triphala, Patriot Greens, Paractin
    MTHFR compound heterozygous
    Igenex IGM positive Lyme, minoMWF

    #461966
    lynnie_sydney
    Participant

    My AP Doctor has always maintained that a bout of flu (virus) can have a major effect on the efficacy of an abx protocol – and that it may require changing. Sounds like that may be bacteriophage related.

    Be well! Lynnie

    Palindromic RA 30 yrs (Chronic Lyme?)
    Mino 2003-2008 100mg MWF - can no longer tolerate any tetracyclines
    rotating abx protocol now. From Sep 2018 MWF - a.m. Augmentin Duo 440mg + 150mg Biaxsig (roxithromycin). p.m. Cefaclor (375mg) + Klacid 125mg + LDN 3mg + Annual Clindy IV's
    Diet: no gluten, dairy, sulphites, low salicylates
    Supps: 600mg N-AC BID, 1000mg Vit C, P5P 40mg, zinc picolinate 60mg, Lithium orotate 20mg, Magnesium Oil, Bio-identical hormones (DHEA + Prog + Estrog)

    #461967
    Pinkmoth
    Keymaster

    On the topic of viruses, my llmd is having me start Lauricidin. A bit nervous about it but will report on effects

    Autoimmune: ANA positive speckled. Probable MCTD with SD overlap. Hashimoto's. Possible Erlos Danlos. Mold Illness.
    Infections: Bartonella, toxoplasmosis, mycoplasma, EBV
    Meds: minocycline (Zydus generic) 100mg 1x daily,
    Supps: digestive enzymes, Monolaurin, Betaine hydrochloric acid, iron, quercetin, biocidin

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