Is it possible to herx from a probiotic?

[spacehoppa]

Hi, I'm clutching at straws a little here, but I thought I'd ask all you knowledgeable guys anyway…

I've started taking the Dr Mercola probiotics, and they are brilliant – 60 billion per capsule – and they seem to have largely got my bowel yeast overgrowth under control.

But now I am in a big flare. It's most likely due to reducing my steroids too far and too fast, as well as halving the minocycline about 8 weeks or so ago. But the bad flare has happened in the last 10 days since I started these probiotics, so it's vaguely possible that they are implicated.

Is it possible that the die-off that the probiotics is causing is affecting my joints? Has anyone else ever had this happen?

I do get badly affected by the die-off caused by fluconazole, which is why I wanted to reduce the frequency that I have to take it. It gives me cramps and diarrhea whenever I take it. I've had no cramps and no diarrhea with the probiotics, just a nice calm bowel. But now I'm wondering whether they're working a bit too well? Or am I just being paranoid?

After all, I have been reducing the doses of my drugs left, right and centre over the past few months. (I have got rid of my nighttime dose of steroids, got rid of the anti-inflammatories altogether, come off the contraceptive pill, come off humira and halved my minocycline dose.)

One last thing, I've also walked too far too quickly one day last week, and gone swimming – which often makes me flare. I have really done this to myself, I can see that. I was trying to reduce doses too far, too fast. It breaks my heart to have to go back on nighttime steroids again, but if I'm to be able to walk, I'm going to have to do that, starting tonight. Plus, I think restarting the higher dose of minocycline is a must now as well.

Bah!

[Kim]

Hi Ruth,

Sorry for this setback when you've been on a nice steady roll recently.  You have such keen body awareness you're probably right on with your assumption of this being a herx from the probiotics, in addition to too many changes over a short period of time. 

If I were in your shoes I would put heavy emphasis on detoxing.  If you have any access to a sauna it may provide some pain relief and prevent you having to ramp up the steroids again.

Take care…..kim

[nord]

Hello Ruth,

sorry to read about your difficulties:crying:

This came up as I looked around for info on pre- and probiotics:

http://www.cpnhelp.org/a_little_experimentation_

Without knowing what Dr Mercola's probiotics contain, it seems obvious that probiotics can cause herxes (have ordered Reuteri-containing probiotics myself, perhaps foolishly curious :)).

Heat can also act against microbes (swimming in a therapy-heated pool? exercising, even walking will increase temp, probably more so in the joints, which are normally cooler than surrounding structures), and can act synergistically with abx (seems many measures can).

Exercise can elevate the absorption of abx (and other drugs), so can to some extent counter reduced doses.

So, there are several possible explanations for herxing. I hope you can sort it out, and recover soon.

Take care

[spacehoppa]

Hi Nord, thanks for the link to that interesting post. I hadn't heard that before. I've been thinking on it more today and I've realized that I've really brought this on myself. My body has given me loads of warning signs and every time I've just ignored it and carried on regardless. I've been doing incredibly stupid things like carrying my 18 month old son up a hill to my son's school. And then even when my knees complained doing the same thing again next day. I could slap myself I really could. And then going swimming in a pool with a current was pretty much the last straw for my knees. Interestingly the only part of my body that has swollen is my knees. I've been doing a lot more than usual, walking the dog and taking my son to school and basically I've been abusing my remission. I do think I need to increase the minocycline back to 200mg as a matter of priority though.

Kim, I'd love to go in a sauna, but don't have the space or money for one at home at the moment. I'm tempted to look into a gym membership, but again, money is an issue and just finding the time to go would be difficult. I'm definitely considering it though. Thanks, as always, for your advice. Hopefully I can get back to where I was soon.

[Trudi]

[user=415]spacehoppa[/user] wrote:

Kim, I'd love to go in a sauna, but don't have the space or money for one at home at the moment.

Hi Ruth–

Here is an article on using a hot bath, although it will increase die-off which may not be what you need at the moment, but keep in mind for the future–

http://www.lymediseaseresource.com/wordpress/when-was-your-last-bath/

I feel for your swollen knees.  I'm, unfortunately, all too familiar with how difficult walking is with swollen knees. 

I hope things settle down for you in a real fast hurry–

Take care,

Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[charli]

Space hoppa-

I have been wondering this same thing.  I have a hard time taking probiotics because of the way they make me feel.  Weak, flu like, more pain, etc.  I just tried the intensive care pearls and felt terribly worse for 2 days.  They really help with the bloating in my stomach but not sure if thats worth all the other symptoms.  I know I have a problem with yeast and my diet is not the greatest so I really want to take them but I just can't hardly stand the worsening of symptoms especially working full time.  Not sure what to do either.  I have just recently added coconut oil to my diet and I feel like it is actually helping with my bloating and digestion a little.  It is also very easy and pleasant to take and is supposed to be good for the yeast. 

Take care,

Charli 

[Author]

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