Gelatin for detox

[cavalier]

Trudi – Cloves have such a impact – have read of it for being good for fighting Lyme but have never found what is considered to be a amount one should use. Wondered what your N.D. suggested?

Tx Jill SD, Lyme & CPn.

[Krys]

Trudi,
For me, even 1/2 tsp in a big ginger/carrot (gluten free) cake, would cause a big neurological reaction. So that would mean 1 slice would be less than 1/10 of a capsule? Once I removed cloves, no reaction.
Krys

[Marybeth]

Hi Krys,
You mentioned you make your own turmeric capsules. Can you elaborate on how you do this. I take a product that my nutritionist suggested called KappArest (Biotics Research) and also Opticleanse which all have turmeric in them. I also cook a lot of Indian food and take the liberty of putting in turmeric most of the times even if it doesn’t call for it.

Mentioning about the thread being hijacked, I think that is the nature of the internet. You start reading an article and shortly you are linked to something of interest. It can add interest or not. In this case, interest!

Thanks,
Marybeth

[Krys]

@Marybeth wrote:

You mentioned you make your own turmeric capsules. Can you elaborate on how you do this.

I started encapsulating my own herbs over 3 years ago, at the onset of what I thought was classic RA.
I bought some herb books and got totally thrilled with “Herbal Remedies. A quick and Easy Guide to Common Disorders and Their Herbal Treatments” by Asa Hershoff, N.D. and Andrea Rotelli, N.D. I read and I read, I took notes what herbs could be useful for me (arthritis, detoxification, inflammation, digestion, etc) and the last section of the book which mentions usual recommended dosages made me decide to do it myself. I searched the internet for encapsulating devices and I decided on
Cap-M-Quick, “0” size Capsule Filler + sold separately Cap-M-Quick Size “0” Acessory Tamper, which you use to press the herbal powder so that the capsule will be filled up with more herbs. The pictures on the boxes explain how to do it.
I was buying empty capsules from various sources and lately I did either from Amazon or from “iherbs”, which gives a discount to first buyers and there is an additional coupon. I bought 10 bags of 1000 capsules (it came up to little over $6 a bag) and I use them for myself + share them with my family.

As far as herbal suppliers:
– http://www.mountainroseherbs.com (click on “Products”, then on “bulk herb and spices”) is an excellent supplier of organic herbs, if one buys at 1lb, bigger amounts (bulk tea counts, too) there’s a nice discount which often makes organic herbs cheaper than inorganic ones elsewhere. They sell organic vegetable capsules, too.
I also use http://www.herbalcom.com for cheaper source of herbs and occasionally different sources if I cannot find what I need.
http://www.starwest-botanicals.com carries a bigger selection than the above.

I get herbal extracts at Amazon or http://www.1stChineseHerbs.com. In fact they are advertizing now a free capsule filler with an order of 5lbs of powdered bulk herbs (1 pound size). I personally do not like that particular filler (encapsulates 25 caps) as it is more awkward to use than Cap-M-Quick. “00” size is rarely used, so I wouldn’t personally go for it.
Another store to go for both extracts and whole herbs is Susan Ambrosino’s http://www.myherbs.net It is a bit more difficult to navigate but they have an excellent customer service.

The advantage of self encapsulating is that there are no fillers, no excipients, like magnesium stearate that slows down absorption of nutrients in our digestive tract and affects detrimentally T-cells. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/06/23/whole-food-supplement-dangers.aspx
It is much cheaper (sometimes only a little cheaper) and I find it very empowering!

Warm wishes, Krys

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

Trudi, I get even worse (over the roof, like insanity) neuropathies on cloves. Same on Wormwood. Cinnamon Casia does same as Cat’s Claw (less than cloves), sweet cinnamon – none. So maybe it is Babesia’s die off toxins being so very poisonous to the nervous system? I am getting some mild neuropathies on A-Babs now, but less than on the above. Cloves have the most toxic effect for me.

Very interesting! I will have to keep watch on the cloves. At this point in time I don’t have problems with my nervous system. I had it really bad in the early ’90’s–panic attacks, dizzy spells, vision problems, brain fog, etc. I was in a bad way. Cipro (prescribed for a stomach bacteria) knocked everything out. I have to admit I would rather the tendon damage then the neurological problems back then. Since fluoroquinolones are cummulative, by the time I started using Cat’s Claw, I probably had enough in my system.

That + Stephania helped me get off steroids. My only exposure to quinine is through Bag Balm. It’s awesome! How do you get quinine? Is it by prescription?

I’ve heard that Stephania is supposed to be pretty good. My only exposure to quinine is in tonic water :). My pharmacist said you can’t get quinine anymore. I didn’t check into this, so don’t know if this is so.

Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Trudi]

@cavalier wrote:

Trudi – Cloves have such a impact – have read of it for being good for fighting Lyme but have never found what is considered to be a amount one should use. Wondered what your N.D. suggested?

She didn’t. I just shake some into my smoothie–
Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

I bought some herb books and got totally thrilled with “Herbal Remedies. A quick and Easy Guide to Common Disorders and Their Herbal Treatments” by Asa Hershoff, N.D. and Andrea Rotelli, N.D.

Hi Krys–
Have you heard of this book–Herbs of the Bible: 2000 Years of Plant Medicine, written by medicinal herbalist James A. Duke, Ph.D and former chief of the USDA Medicinal Plant Laboratory?:
http://www.amazon.com/Herbs-Bible-Years-Plant-Medicine/dp/1885653166

The book, The Maker’s Diet by Jordan S. Rubin, was recently recommended to me. I got it from my library–very good information. The author mentions the above herb book.

Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Krys]

@Trudi wrote:

At this point in time I don’t have problems with my nervous system. I had it really bad in the early ’90’s–panic attacks, dizzy spells, vision problems, brain fog, etc. I was in a bad way. Cipro (prescribed for a stomach bacteria) knocked everything out. I have to admit I would rather the tendon damage then the neurological problems back then.

…My only exposure to quinine is in tonic water :). My pharmacist said you can’t get quinine anymore.

Neurological reactions are the toughest and the most scary ones to me. I can relate to your saying that you’s rather have physical damage than going through neurological problems.
They have resurfaced big time for me now.
I’ve found some methods to relax them and they work for a little bit – 20 minutes up to a couple hours. Still searching for more.
I’m thinking of doing brain retraining programs like Gupta Amygdala Retraining or Hopper’s “Dynamic Neural Retraining System”. I’ve realized that the methods I came up with and used on myself brought such deep relief and the sense of safety and well-being, even if only for 20-30 minutes, anything that helps sedate the overfiring system is very welcome.
After watching some Donna Eden’s DVDs, I’ve just started doing some exercises on calming the triple warmer meridian (the one that feeds fight or flight response), strengthening the spleen meridian (responsible for all the evils when it’s weak: infection, inflammation, all autoimmune diseases, overcharged emotional responses, muscle weakness). It’s bound to help if I don’t self sabotage it and work on it daily.
I’d so like all the neuro aspects to be all gone.

@Trudi wrote:

Have you heard of this book–Herbs of the Bible: 2000 Years of Plant Medicine, written by medicinal herbalist James A. Duke, Ph.D and former chief of the USDA Medicinal Plant Laboratory?:

The book, The Maker’s Diet by Jordan S. Rubin, was recently recommended to me.

Thank you, Trudi! I heard about both of them but have not read them. I’ll get them from my library now and I’m sure I’ll enjoy reading them!
Warm wishes,
Krys

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

Neurological reactions are the toughest and the most scary ones to me. They have resurfaced big time for me now. I’d so like all the neuro aspects to be all gone.

Hi Krys–
Since they have “resurfaced”, aside from Lyme and company, have you had any traumatic experiences? I know they can cause PTS symptoms. I hate to hear you going through this. It is no picnic. I will keep you in my prayers.
Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Krys]

@Trudi wrote:

.. have you had any traumatic experiences? I know they can cause PTS symptoms. I hate to hear you going through this. It is no picnic. I will keep you in my prayers.

Thank you, Trudi. How very astute!
I guess the totality could be called traumatic for my body: I deeply crashed on LDN and did not recover when I started Bartonella treatment 3 months later, which deepened all the bad issues. And then I had 2 major stressors that I could not cope with and my brain became very toxic, overloaded, borderline insane.
Thank you for the prayers! You are an angel! 😛
Warm wishes, Krys

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

Cinnamon Casia does same as Cat’s Claw (less than cloves), sweet cinnamon – none. So maybe it is Babesia’s die off toxins being so very poisonous to the nervous system?

Hi Krys–
A new thread was started “Lyme Disease and IVIG infusions by Creative77” and she mentioned that she was taking Cinnamon Bark Oil for Lyme. I did a bit of searching and sure enough cinnamon is good for Lyme. You may be so right in your conclusion of die-off symptoms–

http://goodbyelyme.com/free-articles/healing-pain/why-you-need-cinnamon-in-your-healing-lyme-disease-diet

Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Krys]

Thank you, Trudi!
Very interesting! I’ve never even heard of cinnamon twigs. And had no idea it helps with oxygenation of blood, circulation and protecting the body, also the brain, from toxins.
Those are the most interesting for me quotes:

Many people with Lyme disease experience heart palpitations. One kind of palpitation is thought to be caused by a lack of energy in the kidneys and the heart, cinnamon bark combined with the herbs ginseng and cooked rehmannia can help to alleviate it. Another kind of palpitation is thought to be caused by the heart lacking enough warmth, cinnamon twig combined with the herb salvia helps to stop these. (…)

One study on Alzheimer’s Disease shows how cinnamon bark extracts helped keep neuronal cells in brain tissue samples alive despite depriving them of oxygen and glucose. Inflammation in these brain cells was significantly reduced by these extracts also. Since Alzheimer’s Disease has many similarities to advanced neurological Lyme disease, cinnamon extract may help to restore brain functioning in Lyme patients. Cinnamon can help with sleep, too.

Very interesting.
I had palpitations in the past due to many different reasons: bacterial, toxins, thick blood, not enough magnesium…
I’m having them again now. I am on abx, I don’t have thick blood, I take magnesium. I know that my kidneys are very low on energy, so are other organs.
I got inspired by the article and re-tested cassia 3 days ago (after you provided the link) and the feeling of irritated and inflamed membranes within the heart and brain have not subsided yet. What a bummer!
But what great solutions for all with no adverse reactions!!!!
Krys

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

I got inspired by the article and re-tested cassia 3 days ago (after you provided the link) and the feeling of irritated and inflamed membranes within the heart and brain have not subsided yet. What a bummer!

Hi Krys–
I had cinnamon tea the day I read about this. Did I ever start to ache!! I also got some petechiea on both arms. Along with Lyme, does it also hit the Babesia?? I think so. I will try it off and on to see what continues to happen. My husband was surprised to see how quickly I responded to it. When I was on colloidal silver via the LLMD, I also reacted within a 1/2 hour.
Hope you are feeling better,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Krys]

@Trudi wrote:

Did I ever start to ache!! I also got some petechiea on both arms. Along with Lyme, does it also hit the Babesia?? I think so.

Maybe it does, your pain reaction and new petechiae look like herx.

But I think, for me, there may be some other reasons involved.
I don’t believe that all of a sudden (well, like last full year “sudden”, and especially of late) I have multiplied my bug load. If the reason was solely bacterial, my response would be diminishing instead of intensifying.
So, I don’t know.
Maybe the heightened negative response is bug’s last resort survival mechanism: “don’t hurt us or else”? But they use this mechanism from the very beginning: it is toxins and resultant herxheimer response, so lower bacterial load should be producing a lessened response.
So I wonder if my response has more to do with metabolic pathways being ever more compromised, due to constant exposure to bacterial toxins over the years?

I’ve gained huge amount of ground but my chemical sensitivity instead of subsiding, is heightened. My brain has improved so much but responds to both emotional and physical toxins faster and more fiercely.
Even food sensitivity: I can have organic cocoa and organic chocolate, but respond with brain toxicity to inorganic ones. Same with coffee.
Reaction to food dyes subsided, rye gluten is OK, rice became totally fine.

I’ve been “dancing around” (would buy them but don’t really have the time, so keep contemplating buying) Gupta’s or Annie Hopper’s brain retraining programs.
I think a lot of my responses are due to my heightened “fight of flight” response and my brain’s perception of danger lurking around, even in cinnamon! Planet Thrive has some good posts regarding that. Faster EFT (also described at Planet Thrive) often helps with ugly bodily response.
As it probably is also related to toxin damage, I’ve decided to use more often whatever detox methods still work for me.

I’ve also noticed that heightened reactions may be related (at least to a degree) to depleted enzymes with the body. Whenever I drink fermented kefir (home made one), many of the bodily reactions instantaneously subside! Unfortunately, I’m allergic to milk casein and can safely drink kefir only 2 x a week. But greatly enjoy the respite when I do! 😀

It may be the combination of all those reasons (bacterial toxins, toxin related damage, heightened fight or flight, damaged mucosa that overreacts to harsh chemicals within the herbs, acquired allergy or inappropriate allergic response because the herbs contain something close to what the body had already decided to be allergic to, depleted enzymes, inability to produce required enzymes, messed up metabolism) and possibly many more reasons that are not so apparent.

Ugrr!!!
But: I’m no more in pain (or just slight), no light sensitivity, no double vision (well, almost…), no headaches, no balance problems (rare), small numbness that comes and goes (related to leaky gut and food sensitivities), no amnesia, no Bell’s, no MS symptoms, no SD symptoms…. Just intensified chemical sensitivity, air hunger, exhaustion, digestive issues, heart problems, brain craziness after A-Babs and A-Bart + after abx, painful spleen, and many weird reactions after herbs. Still some Bart and Babs skin manifestations.
More good news: I’m coming back to normal from reactions to cinnamon ! 😀

We’ve learned so much. I think we’ll recover any time soon! And what great appreciation of life and all the goodies in it it will be! I can’t wait! 😆
Krys

[Trudi]

@Krys wrote:

Maybe it does, your pain reaction and new petechiae look like herx.

Agreed–die-off symptoms.

I have multiplied my bug load. If the reason was solely bacterial, my response would be diminishing instead of intensifying.

When I started turmeric, I could only use it maybe a week at a time and then rest because of what I am guessing was herxing. Now I use it everyday without stop with apparently no problems. However, the cinnamon reaction made me wonder the same as you–what is my bug load?

So I wonder if my response has more to do with metabolic pathways being ever more compromised, due to constant exposure to bacterial toxins over the years?

Maybe!

I think a lot of my responses are due to my heightened “fight of flight” response and my brain’s perception of danger lurking around, even in cinnamon!

Oh, yes, what we think has a huge affect on our bodies!!!!

Whenever I drink fermented kefir (home made one), many of the bodily reactions instantaneously subside!

There was a time in the not too recent past that I could NOT eat anything fermented without resulting with a lot of pain. That seems to have subsided (although I still have to be somewhat careful with vinegar). Since January I have added kefir to my smoothies–mmmm, so good :).

But: I’m no more in pain (or just slight), no light sensitivity, no double vision (well, almost…), no headaches, no balance problems (rare), small numbness that comes and goes (related to leaky gut and food sensitivities), no amnesia, no Bell’s, no MS symptoms, no SD symptoms….

This is wonderful!

Just intensified chemical sensitivity, air hunger, exhaustion, digestive issues, heart problems, brain craziness after A-Babs and A-Bart + after abx, painful spleen, and many weird reactions after herbs. Still some Bart and Babs skin manifestations.

I hate to sound trite, but this too shall pass!!

We’ve learned so much. I think we’ll recover any time soon! And what great appreciation of life and all the goodies in it it will be! I can’t wait! 😆

Yes, and so much the stronger for the trials.

Take care,
Trudi

Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

[Author]

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