Home Forums General Discussion Boston Globe Lyme article

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  • #307734
    Suzanne
    Participant
    #369445
    Maz
    Keymaster

    Thanks, Suzanne…I almost find the commentaries by posters at the end of articles to be more interesting than the articles these days. ๐Ÿ˜† Fascinating that this topic creates so much ire and venom in folks. My hope is that we can get away from this distraction and the scientific community can just get on with the task of finding out what is keeping people sick. As history has shown, there is often disgruntlement prior to a paradigm shift in medicine (e.g. AIDs and Fibromyalgia)…let’s hope this is a sign of change to come.

    I see Dr. Linda K. Bockenstedt’s research quoted a lot (professor of rheumatology at Yale School of Medicine) and I find her work disappointing in light of the fact that she limits persistence to residual spirochetal proteins upon the assumption that the organism is long-gone. In an excerpt from the article, the author writes:

    “They, along with other scientists, are searching for the reasons that symptoms persist in some treated Lyme patients. Dr. Linda K. Bockenstedt, a professor at Yale School of Medicine, has found traces of proteins from the Lyme spirochete within joints and adjacent to cartilage after Lyme-infected mice were treated with antibiotics. She and her colleagues suggest that these leftover proteins could be causing an immune reaction that helps keep joints inflamed after the bacteria have been killed.”

    What about cystic forms, which are known to have reduced outer surface proteins and can revert to live spirochetes when the coast is clear? These most definitely could be creating an immune reaction!!! Research on murine models out of Finland has already demonstrated that when mice are treated with abx and become sero-negative will produce live spirochetes when given anti-TNF meds, the biologic drugs, like Humira and Enbrel, commonly used in rheumatology to treat rheumatic diseases. What is so hard for a researcher of her standing to understand about that? Why just assume that the proteins found are “residual” when they could indeed be the whole organism in a self-protected state?

    http://www.columbia-lyme.org/research/keyarticles.html

    “Commentary. These two studies demonstrate that Bb spirochetes can persist in the mouse after ceftriaxone therapy. The Finish study was remarkable in that culture and PCR were negative after ceftriaxone but, after additional treatment with anti-TNF-alpha, viable spirochetes were recovered. TNF is a pro-inflammatory cytokine which, when blocked, typically results in a reduction in clinical inflammation; for this reason, such treatment is used for patients with rheumatoid arthritis. To the surprise of the authors, viable spirochetes were recovered in these PCR- and culture-negative mice after TNF blocking treatment was given. Also interesting is that anti-TNF treatment did not result in the expected finding of a reduction of joint swelling.

    The Finnish study was the first study to demonstrate that immunomodulatory treatment of animals infected with Bb could convert them from culture negative to culture positive.”

    I find it unreasonable that researchers are not looking at the full extent of available research that is out there to make their conclusions. No wonder the biologic drugs have warnings on them for possible MS and Lupus-like reactions!!! ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    #369446
    Lynne G.SD
    Participant

    Here is a bit more on Lyme from CBS news
    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-575991681/cdc-lyme-disease

    #369447
    Maz
    Keymaster

    @Lynne G./SD wrote:

    Here is a bit more on Lyme from CBS news
    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-575991681/cdc-lyme-disease

    Hi Lynne,

    Was this the show segment you are referring to (after ad plays)?

    http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50153314n

    If so, terrific coverage from a NY dermatologist! ๐Ÿ™‚

    #369448
    Lynne G.SD
    Participant

    Hi Maz;
    Since I can’t get videos or sound on my dial up computer(live in the country,no high speed here) I can’t say.I saw this on the Mozilla Firefox main page with the news last night.

    #369449
    Suzanne
    Participant

    @Maz wrote:

    Thanks, Suzanne…I almost find the commentaries by posters at the end of articles to be more interesting than the articles these days. ๐Ÿ˜†

    I find it unreasonable that researchers are not looking at the full extent of available research that is out there to make their conclusions. No wonder the biologic drugs have warnings on them for possible MS and Lupus-like reactions!!! ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    I never read anything any more without also reading the comments. Of course, that often means coming away with a completely opinion than I had when I finished the article.

    I so agree about the biologics and neuro symptoms. I have thought that for a very long time.

    Mom of teen daughter with Poly JIA since age 2. Current med: azithromycin 250 mg MWF.

    #369450
    Trudi
    Participant

    @Suzanne wrote:

    @Maz wrote:

    I never read anything any more without also reading the comments.

    Same here! Excellent news report/coverage of Lyme.

    Trudi

    Lyme/RA; AP 4/2008 off and on to 3/2010; past use of quinolones may be the cause of my current problems, (including wheelchair use); all supplements (which can aggravate the condition) were discontinued on 10/14/2012. Am now treating for the homozygous MTHFR 1298 mutation. Off of all pain meds since Spring '14 (was on them for years--doctor is amazed--me too). Back on pain med 1/2017. Reinfected? Frozen shoulder?

    #369451
    cavalier
    Participant

    Nice to see this finally getting good news coverage this can only help people to put pressure on doc’s to treat the more who do this the more doc’s cant continue to ignore. Her point at the end of treating the yard we just took out a contract for a pest service to treat our yard – I have tick collars on my dogs but I am the one who was still without protection & after getting a tick in the back of my hair last year causing me neuro symptoms that abated after I found it & already having chronic
    Lyme. I got another crawling on my hand this year from just a few min’s of being outside I said enuf. My husband ironically does all of our yard work & has never in the 8 yrs of being here found a tick – maybe they sense I am already weak I dunno or they like my blood better but …

    Jill

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