oregano oil

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Re: oregano oil

Postby anno » Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:39 am

Maz wrote:
Ruffian wrote:

If on a low, pulsed protocol, he may even suggest you remain on your tetra and add a penicillin in on your off days (as they can't be taken together).


This is interesting--I assumed you would have to switch to a 'cillin for awhile and then back to mino. Maz, Do I understand you to say that you can take a 'cillin & mino on alternate days?
RA fall of '03
started ap 8/08:mino 100mg MWF;probiotics; started LDN 3.5mg 8/10, stopped 1/11.
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Re: oregano oil

Postby Maz » Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:40 am

anno wrote:
Maz wrote:

If on a low, pulsed protocol, he may even suggest you remain on your tetra and add a penicillin in on your off days (as they can't be taken together).


This is interesting--I assumed you would have to switch to a 'cillin for awhile and then back to mino. Maz, Do I understand you to say that you can take a 'cillin & mino on alternate days?



Hi Anno,

Yes. :) There is info at the following link on WebMD:

http://www.webmd.com/drugs/drug-7722-mi ... genumber=9

"How the interaction occurs:

When these two medicines are taken together, tetracycline may interfere with the beneficial effects of penicillin."


What might happen:

A decrease in the beneficial effects of your penicillin antibiotic may occur, which would decrease the effectiveness in treating your infection.

What you should do about this interaction:

Contact your healthcare professionals (e.g. doctor or pharmacist) as soon as possible about taking these two medicines together. If it is essential that both these medicines be taken, take the penicillin and tetracycline on a schedule that separates them by as many hours as possible.Your healthcare professionals may already be aware of this interaction and may be monitoring you for it. Do not start, stop, or change the dosage of any medicine before checking with them first."


So, essentially, these two can't be taken together when daily dosing is being used, as tetras reduce the effects of the penicillin, but when pulsed, every other day dosing is being used, the penicillin could be used on the off days. The effects of the penicillin may be still somewhat ameliorated by declining serum levels of minocycline, but treatment can still provide some beneficial effects done this way. I think Lynnie has done this type of pulsing so you could ask her about how it's worked for her.

Also, while I was on daily high dose Moxatag and Diflucan, I asked my doc if I could still pulse in low dose doxy. He said 100mg doxy MWF shouldn't interfere too much with the Moxatag, so he allowed it. I just didn't want to lose the cartilage protective effects of not using a tetra while on longterm peniciillin (8months). So, I took the Moxatag in the morning and PM and added in doxy during the afternoon, spaced 8 hours away. This type of pulsing may not be possible if one is not using the extended release amoxicillin for an acute infection, as the doses are usually given 3 times per day to keep bacteriocidal serum levels up. This sort of protocol would need approval of a doc who knows what they're doing, though, and follows you closely with monthly labs (especially because of diflucan which can be hard on liver). ;)
RA/Lyme - ABX since 11/06
Personal Progress Thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=301
Current Abx Protocol:
Clarithromycin 500mg BID re-started 11/5/13 (dose increased to 500mg BID on 7/3/14
Compounded Liposomal Artemisinin ("Artemisinin Essentials") restarted 7/3/14, 2 caps twice daily, 5 days per week for 3 weeks each month with 7 days off
Ivermectin 2mg (rx compounded) daily, started 9/21/11
Various staple supps: Enhansa, NAC, ALA, Morinda Supreme, KriaXanthin, B Complex, Milk Thistle, Dessicated Adrenal, Adaptan-All, Probiotics, Systemic Enzymes, Vit D3, Magnesium Citrate, Sodium Ascorbate, ImmunoPro, Nrf2 Activator, Liposomal glutathione, compounded topical progesterone.
Intermittent supps: Chemet every third day, along with NAC and BioPure Chorella followed by BioActive Minerals day following oral chelation. Weekly Myer's Cocktails and Glutathione IV Pushes for detoxification. Tri-salts and Opticleanse GHI.
FIR Sauna and other detox methods as described in Personal Progress Thread.
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Re: oregano oil

Postby kali » Fri Jan 20, 2012 3:43 pm

Maz,
Does this 'issue' of seperating tetra and other abx also include azithromycin? I am thinking about pulsing it in for strep....or is penicillin a better choice? What are the advantages of azithromycin?

Thanks Maz,
Kali
dx: RA
Began AP June, 2011 with Clindy and doxy. Did well - little herx until late Sept. after severe cold. Changed to mino in Nov. and experienced BIG herxing.
100mg Mino every 3rd day Ex. M-Th-Su-W-Sa-Tu-F then repeat.
Very little herxing on this schedule. Seeing good improvement.
Back to light workouts in the gym several days a week.
kali
 
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Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 8:17 pm

Re: oregano oil

Postby Maz » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:30 pm

kali wrote:Does this 'issue' of seperating tetra and other abx also include azithromycin? I am thinking about pulsing it in for strep....or is penicillin a better choice? What are the advantages of azithromycin?



Hi Kali,

No, azithromycin is complementary with tetracyclines. :) I am currently using tetracycline and azithromycin and taking my doses together and they make very good companions.

I can only speak to personal experience of using azithromycin and Moxatag (extended release amoxicillin) in terms of efficacy. Although azithromycin works really well in combo with a tetra, it was only when I went on high dose Moxatag (775mgBID) that my anti-CCP started coming down in leaps and bounds. I don't know why this would be other than that I was using a much higher dose (for Lyme) at the time. Everyone's pathogen load is different, as well as response, so it might mean trying different approaches to protocol to find what works for the individual. Here's where working with an experienced AP doc or LLMD really helps. One of the downsides of amoxicillin treatment is that it can interact with methotrexate, so would likely be contraindicated for anyone using this drug.

Spectrum of activity (susceptible bugs) varies for azithromycin and penicillin, so this will account for why one may work better for a person with strep than penicillin and vice-versa, as these abx may be hitting different things in addition to strep. Their actions are different, too. While amoxy is a beta-lactam abx that only hits cell-walled forms, azithromycin, classed as a macrolide, has a broader spectrum of activity, having some effect on both cell-walled and cell-wall-less organisms (i.e. has both bacteriocidal and bacteriostatic props). I am not clear on how much bacteriocidal activity (on cell-walled forms) azithromycin may have in small,pulsed doses and this may well be dose-dependent.

Here is some info outlined in brief on wiki for both, but you'll find more info on other sites, like Drugs.com:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azithromycin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amoxicillin

Hope something here helps, Kali! :)
RA/Lyme - ABX since 11/06
Personal Progress Thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=301
Current Abx Protocol:
Clarithromycin 500mg BID re-started 11/5/13 (dose increased to 500mg BID on 7/3/14
Compounded Liposomal Artemisinin ("Artemisinin Essentials") restarted 7/3/14, 2 caps twice daily, 5 days per week for 3 weeks each month with 7 days off
Ivermectin 2mg (rx compounded) daily, started 9/21/11
Various staple supps: Enhansa, NAC, ALA, Morinda Supreme, KriaXanthin, B Complex, Milk Thistle, Dessicated Adrenal, Adaptan-All, Probiotics, Systemic Enzymes, Vit D3, Magnesium Citrate, Sodium Ascorbate, ImmunoPro, Nrf2 Activator, Liposomal glutathione, compounded topical progesterone.
Intermittent supps: Chemet every third day, along with NAC and BioPure Chorella followed by BioActive Minerals day following oral chelation. Weekly Myer's Cocktails and Glutathione IV Pushes for detoxification. Tri-salts and Opticleanse GHI.
FIR Sauna and other detox methods as described in Personal Progress Thread.
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Re: oregano oil

Postby kali » Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:08 pm

Hope something here helps, Kali!


Yes. It all helps Maz. I will sort through it with my doctor on Monday. He has learned about AP through me but is pretty good when it comes to knowing the mechanism behind diseases and proper treatments so I'm hoping we can come to a solution. We may decide to just leave things the same for now. I have finally stopped most of the major herxing from my minocycline and have actually been able to take 100mg MWF this week. Maybe I should allow myself to get to the recommended dose of mino (100BID MWF) before I switch things up. Any input on this is welcome :) .
I believe since I have a history of strep, but my titers are negative, it will be hard to figure out (as you said earlier) how long to stay on the 'strep' antibiotic. I'm not sure this is something I want to guess at...
Thank you Maz

Wishing everyone wellness,
Kali
dx: RA
Began AP June, 2011 with Clindy and doxy. Did well - little herx until late Sept. after severe cold. Changed to mino in Nov. and experienced BIG herxing.
100mg Mino every 3rd day Ex. M-Th-Su-W-Sa-Tu-F then repeat.
Very little herxing on this schedule. Seeing good improvement.
Back to light workouts in the gym several days a week.
kali
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 8:17 pm

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